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START OF FILE: 2025-05-16 - Putting the What Do You Mean By podcast on trial one last time - .txt
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SERMON DETAILS
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Date:     2025-05-16
Title:    Putting the "What Do You Mean By" podcast on trial one last time
Speaker:  
Church:   What Do You Mean By
Type:     Podcast
Duration: 1h 19m
Language: English
URL:      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjKL985BjNQ
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Description:
Putting the "What Do You Mean By" podcast on trial one last time
TRANSCRIPT
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mic over here for the people on YouTube and Facebook. My bad. I'm sorry. Let's go. I get to do it again. All right. For the people on YouTube and Facebook, my bad. I'm sorry. There we go. Praise the Lord. We're back. Sorry about that, guys. All right. We're going to pray and we'll get right into this. God bless you. Lord, I have your perfect will. Help us to do things just the way you'd have us do them. Give it all to you in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ. Surrender myself to you in the name of the Lord Jesus. Amen. So, the court is now in session. All rise. This hearing is now in session for in the court of public approval on social media where we compare things with the word of God. The court of uh case number 143, the court of public approval versus what do you mean by the podcast hosted by David Crusane. The charge is creating a ministry that never should have existed. A podcast accused of stirring controversy, questioning leadership, refusing to stay quiet. David Kusain, how do you plead? Not guilty, your honor. Are both the prosecution and defense prepared to proceed? Ready, your honor. All right. Now, prosecution, go ahead with your opening statement. Ladies and gentlemen, this isn't complicated. This is a podcast by a young man with a loud voice and clearly a wounded heart. But he's not under any kind of systemic control. Not under popular ministry, not under control. He reacts publicly. He rants emotionally. And when people question him, he explodes at them. He even drinks Diet Coke. That's going to kill him. was going to give him cancer. When people question him, he explodes. Is that maturity? Or is it simply something that should never have been placed in the public eye? You've heard the excuses, the prophets were hated, too. But are we seriously going to compare this 24-year-old kid that hardly no one ever heard of until he started this nonsense to Jesus? What are the prophets in the Bible? Who does David think he is? If God wanted to bring these controversial things out in the public sphere, why wouldn't God use someone older, someone calmer, someone more experienced and someone more polished and mature, especially not social media. We can agree that's the worst place to have a podcast like this. We're not saying David has bad intentions or he's a bad guy. We're just saying this has never happened before. No one has ever had a podcast on social media that talked about things like this before. And you know, we can agree Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever. And for that reason, since he has never used someone like David in this way before on social media, then we know that this ministry is simply maybe the right thing in the wrong place. David needs to just stick to his own church and do what all the other young preachers do on social media. Lay low, stay silent, and stay in your own lane. Don't do anything controversial ever in the public eye. Is the defense ready for their opening statement? We are, your honor. Precious brothers and sisters of Christ, members of this court, let me begin by asking you something simple. When did God ever use some someone who fit the mold of their day? Moses stuttered. David was supposedly too young to kill Goliath. They told him, "Go get lost. Jeremiah was called a child. Paul was killed Christians. Jesus wasn't a synagogue trained influencer. He taught outside the system on hillsides and boats through parables, not programs. No one had ever done that before." And in 1 Corinthians 27 and 20 verse uh chapter 1 verse 27-28 but it says but God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise. And God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things that which are mighty and base things of the world and things which are despised hath God chosen. Yay and things which are not to bring to not things that are. So yes, my client is 24. Yes, he has a strong tone. Yes, my client is 24. Yes, he has a strong tone. Yes, he has said things that made people uncomfortable. But since when since when has comfort, public comfort, ever been the test of truth? The real question is not whether David Cresin is too emotional. The real question is did he say anything untrue according to the word of God or just untrue according to popular public opinion. And if he didn't say something not true according to the word of God, why are we so concerned with how it sounded? You say, "This has never been done before." But that's exactly what they said about John the Baptist. No one had ever been the voice of one crying in the wilderness, make way for the coming of the Lord, filled with the Holy Ghost from his mother's womb, eating locusts and wild honey, living outside the system with no credentials, no board, no social filter. So that makes him false, right? I mean, Matthew 11:18 says, "For John came neither eating nor drinking, and they say he hath the devil." That's what they said about Paul and Jesus. This is not, they say, "This is not how it's done. He's not who he expected." And yet, it was God the whole time. The defense will show that the very standards used to accuse this podcast would have condemned the prophets, disqualified the apostles, and silenced Jesus himself. You say, "David is a nobody." And while that may sound holy and righteous and right to the public eye, let me ask you this. Is God a respector of persons? Acts 10:34. Then Peter opened his mouth and said, "Of a truth, I perceive that God is no respector of persons." Did not the the prophet of God say that when the weakest Christian gets down to their knees to pray, every demon and hell trembles. Did he not also say his greatest ability was to simply get himself out of the way? And did he not say when any son or daughter of God puts the word of God on their lips and speaks it, it is the same as deity speaking? Now, let me ask you this. Has David ever claimed to have all the answers? Or has he again said the words, "I might be wrong. I hope I'm wrong. I failed you. I was wrong." I mean, which social media preachers are actively making videos like that? I'll tell you. Here's the list. Their names are David Kersain. So I stand here to prove you're not judging the content. You're judging based on gossip, based on Satan whispering in your ear. Are you truly offended by what David is saying? Or have you simply refused to look into it, letting gossip and bias influence your judgment of his tone, his language, his delivery, his personality, and what others are saying about him. Somehow it's based on everything except what the word of God teaches. Since when was gossip okay for the bride of Jesus Christ just because it's shared with a friend or whispered by someone popular or feels righteous on social media. So the question is no longer who does David think he is. The real question is do we judge ministries by public culture standard or by the word of God? Has your definition of truth become filtered by tone, delivery, personality, popularity, or perception instead of the word of God? Is the defense ready to call their first witness? We are, your honor. We call Jeremiah to the stand. Now, if I can just find Jeremiah's hat, I would be happy. All right, cue the elevator music, guys. I'm finding Jeremiah somewhere on my couch. What do you see, Jeremiah? Are you on the couch? Are you on the bed? Or there's no bed in here, actually. Come on, Jeremiah. Tell me where you are. Please. Come on. There he is. He's right here. Jeremiah saw the refrigerator. That's what he saw. There we go. There we are. Hello. Jeremiah and the lawyer. Please state your name for the record. What's up with the Nathan Morris? God bless you. We'll always say hi to you. Tell your dad I said hi. Tell him to watch this episode. Please tell him I love him. I haven't seen him in 10 years, 11 years. Jeremiah, prophet of the Lord. Were you respected and popular in your time, Jeremiah? No. I was mocked, hated, threatened, and rejected by the very people I was sent to. Very unpopular, blocked on all social media all the time. Were your sermons wellreceived even though they were the word of [Music] God. Well, they said I was a traitor, a doom preacher. They threw me in a pit. I told the truth, and they wanted me dead. Ladies and gentlemen, allow me to read from the record. Jeremiah 20:7, I am in derision daily. Everyone mocketh me. Jeremiah is talking about how everyone is mocking him. Jeremiah 20:14, cursed be the day wherein I was born. Sound like anyone you know? Jeremiah, did you ever feel like quitting? Well, of course I did. I tried, but the word of God was like fire shut up in my bones. I could not hold it in. So, your emotions, your anguish didn't disqualify you. No, they proved I wasn't performing. I was burdened. Well, did you ever preach what the people wanted to hear? I mean, come on. You got to be popular, right? You do it for social image. Never. That was Haniah. He told them they'd be fine. He died for lying. God killed him for lying. So to be clear, you were anointed, appointed, and rejected, and blocked on all social media platforms. All mixed up. Oh, sorry. Well, I guess I did. Praise the Lord. Finally, a flaw. You guys can use that in the clips for flaws. All right. So, to be clear, you were anointed, appointed, and rejected all at the same time. That's correct. Jeremiah, would today's religious culture have accepted your ministry? Absolutely not. I would have been labeled toxic, negative, divisive, and not safe for Christians. The next time someone tells you that controversy disqu disqualifies calling, remember this man, a prophet mocked for his tone, hated for his honesty, and burdened by the very word of God that made him weep. And yet he was chosen by God and he was rejected not because he was wrong but because he violated society's unwritten rules. Is the prosecution ready for their cross-examination? We are. Your honor, Prophet Jeremiah, wouldn't you agree your ministry was kind of uh depressing? I mean, well, I I the truth doesn't always feel good. I wouldn't say it was depressing. I'm not sure what you mean by that. But wouldn't it have wouldn't have been more wouldn't your gospel have been more effective if you had just encouraged the people, given them hope, made them feel good? Well, they were going to feel a whole lot worse if they did what they were doing. Hope without repentance is just is just a numbing agent for judgment. But you were thrown into a dungeon. Doesn't that prove you were thrown into a dungeon by the king, by the leaders of your leaders of your time, by the most esteemed popular people? Doesn't that prove your message was maybe a little bit extreme? Well, then Jesus would be extreme, too. They crucified him. But surely, Jeremiah, you could have adjusted your tone, your approach. You made people uncomfortable. Jeremiah. Well, I was told by God not to be afraid of their faces in in chapter 1 and verse 8 of my book. Be not afraid of their faces, for I am with thee to deliver thee, sayaeth the Lord. But wouldn't you agree, Jeremiah, there's a time to just be quiet. A time, Hold on. a time to be quiet. Especially when everyone's rejecting you, just just shut up. Stay in your line. Stay quiet. My flesh felt that way. But my flesh felt that way. Of course, but I said in verse chapter 20 and verse 9, then I said, I will not make mention of him nor speak anymore in his name. But his word was in mine heart as a burning fire shut up in my bones, and I was weary with weary with forbearing, and I could not stay. Objection, your honor. This line of questioning is selfdefeating. Sustained. Jeremiah's burden stands as evidence of divine calling. Is the defense ready to call their next witness? We are, your honor. Defense calls Elijah to the stand once I find him. All right, Elijah, tell us where you are, please. All right, I found Elijah. I just got to put his name on the paper. What's up, L Esther? God bless you. Poor spider. I just taped a spider in this thing. That's hilarious. Elijah. This is Elijah. This is We're just calling this guy Elijah. be right with you guys. I'm putting it together. Just give me a second. What's up, Sister Letter? God bless you. Isn't this fun? Praise the Lord. Can you say praise the Lord? I can say praise the Lord. Can you? I don't even know if you're saying it, though. You're on the You're on the the social media. This is fun, isn't it? All right. Grab my marker. Elijah, please state your name and purpose for the record. Elijah, prophet of the Lord, prophet of the Lord, God of Israel. Were you uh well-liked in your time, Elijah? No, I was not. I was hunted by kings, hated by the people, misunderstood, even by those who said they believed. Were you ever accused of being the problem? What's the defense doing? Sorry. Were you ever accused of being the problem, Elijah? Yes. Ahab called me the one who troubled Israel. In first Kings 18:17, it says, "Art then a when Ahab say saw Elijah that Ahab said unto me, art thou he that troubleth Israel?" And I answered, "I have not troubled Israel, but thou in thy father's house." Were you speaking gently to the king Ahab? No. I confronted him face to face with the word of the Lord. Were you bold? Of course I was. I even called fire down from heaven. But were you emotional, afraid? Well, I ran from Jezebel. I sat under junat her under a juniper tree and asked to die. So, you did God's calling, got depressed, got suicidal, and your emotions didn't even dis and it's it's in the Bible. And your emotions didn't disqualify your calling. No, God didn't rebuke me for my feelings. He isn't an angel to feed me. He was delicious. Ladies and gentlemen, this is a man who stood alone, who wept, who ran, who burned with holy boldness and broke under the pressure. Yet God still called him. God still used him. And God did not shut down Elijah's ministry because of his flaws. Is the prosecution ready for cross-examination? We are, your honor. Prophet Elijah, let's talk about Mount Carmel. You ch you challen where you challenged 450 prophets of Baal. And during that event, would you say your tone towards them was respectful? No. No. I mocked them loudly. I ridiculed them. You ridiculed them. What do you mean? Yeah, I said cry louder. Maybe your false god is sleeping or on a journey. Or maybe he's just doesn't care about you. And don't you think perhaps your delivery was uh problematic even if your words were technically accurate? Well, I wasn't thinking about the tone. My tone wasn't aimed at comfort. It was aimed at exposure. And I said the word of the Lord. The Bible says I said it at the word of the Lord. And you're saying God approved of that, of your sarcasm? Yes. Yes, he did. No further questions, your honor. Actually, your honor, let me get another one. Well, still, Elijah, don't you think your behavior was a little dramatic? All the yelling, fire from heaven, killing the false prophets. Are you saying that's dramatic? According to what standard? Like really? I mean, come on. You the prosecution, you haven't quoted the Bible. What are you talking about? Well, clearly he could have done it a lot nicer. Sure, maybe he had the truth, but he could have done it a lot in a nice a lot nicer of a way. No further questions, your honor. The defense brings the Apostle Paul to the stand. Please state your name and calling. Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle. Were you always accepted in the church world, Paul? It's wrong one. I'm sorry, guys. Lord, forgive me. The defense is doing this. I'm sorry. Were you always accepted in the church world, Paul? Did everyone always like you? No, I was not. I was doubted by the apostles, accused of not being legitimate. Some called me boastful. Others said my presence was weak and my letters were too harsh. Such as when I said, "For his letters said they are weighty and powerful, but his bodily presence is weak and his speech contemptable." Well, they didn't just like they didn't just dislike your message, Paul. They criticized your delivery. Were you ever sarcastic, Paul? What the prosecution just tried to use to paint Elijah as some bad guy? Yeah, I was I was sarcastic a lot actually. Sarcastic. So, are you saying that sarcasm all the time isn't always wrong? Of course not. It can be a tool to preach truth. We have a witness of Thomas Crusane on Facebook. Being nice all the time brought false sacrifices and false god Being nice all the time brought false sacrifices and false god worship into Israel. It's exactly right. So Paul, those that were nice all the time, how did they treat you when you were preaching the word of God? Well, they rejected it. They hated it. Paul, did you ever name names publicly of people that you disagreed with? Yes, I did. Himenius, Alexander, Peter. I withtood him to the face. Did you ever get emotional in your letters? I pleaded. I wept. I warmed. I warned night and day with tears. Well, did you ever yell? Well, I said, "Oh, foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you." So, your intensity doesn't disqualify your calling, Paul. Well, God didn't choose me because I was safe. He chose me because he wanted to get me to surrender. And he can and he chose me because he knew I would surrender. This is a man who was accused of being too much and yet wrote the word the very word you read today. So before you reject a man for being intense or for being too intense, ask yourself is what is being said passion or pride, emotion or obedience? Because with Paul it was fire from heaven in letter form. Is the prosecution ready for their cross-examination of [Music] Paul? Paul, you admitted to being bold in your letters, but weaker in person. I mean, that's what that scripture says in 2 Corinthians 10:10. For his letters, say they are weighty and powerful, but his bodily presence is weak, and his speech is contemptable. Isn't that right, [Music] Paul? That's what they said. That's what they said. But I didn't come in their definition of what great of what the right kind of approach would look like. I didn't come with man's wisdom. I came in power of God. Well, still, wouldn't you agree? Your tone was at times inappropriate. You guys forget who I am. I am Paul, the Apostle Paul. Truth is rarely welcome in polished form. Polished form. Polish form. Aren't you supposed to say the truth in a way that'll get received, not just a way that's blindly said, Paul? I I I don't know. I'm I said what the truth of the way are. Well, wouldn't you agree, Paul, that saying things in a way that'll get more received is better than just saying them any old way? Well, I suppose that tone does have something to do with it, but that's it. I'm That's That's But calling people foolish, Paul. Mocking legalism, writing letters that cause sorrow, that's not exactly how we do things today, is it, Paul? Why weren't the people clapping and celebrating in your sermons? Paul, the the evidence of of of the correct thing is not a repentant hearten at an altar, right? It's everyone's cheering because they know who they are and that's all you need, right? Come on, Paul. You had brother Brandham said he preached what you preached. And so, I mean, like, come on. Everyone, why wasn't everyone clapping? Why was Why weren't you popular, Paul? I'll tell you why. Because I preach the truth with conviction behind it. That's why. I don't care what public opinion says. I don't care what the kings of the day say. I'm here to preach the truth of God. And I don't care what public perception is. Well, wouldn't your approach be better behind closed doors? When Peter act hypocritically, I withtood him to the face because he was to be blamed. If truth is hidden, what good is it? I have no further questions for Paul, your honor. Clearly, it would Paul, all the congregation, Paul, isn't all the congregation holy because they're chosen in this day? Isn't all of them believers and there's no reason to preach about repentance ever? No reason to talk about repentance. I said I die daily. What do you think that meant? I have to die daily. I have to. And what does that mean? You want to know what that means? I'll tell you what that means. And I'm on the What do you mean by channel? Hi David, what's up? I'll see you in heaven. That means you have to consistently every day prioritize your relationship with Jesus Christ over everything else. That's what dying daily mean means. It's not a checklist. It's not a not doing the things that you like. It's actively choosing every single day to pursue your relationship with Jesus Christ. Don't read your Bible because you're required to. Don't go to church because you want to be socially accepted. Find Jesus because he loves you. Dad, I want to but Well, Paul, you almost make me want to be a believer. Well, I wish that you would. I wish you would stop prioritizing social acceptance over truth of the word of God. Since when was truth supposed to be accepted in the public eye? Paul, you cause division, upro or rebellion. Yeah. These that have turned the world upside down or come hither also. I'll take that as a compliment. Well, I still think you could have said it a little better. Your tone was off. Doesn't matter what you said, your tone matters more. No further questions, your honor. Does defense have any cross-examination? We just have one statement, your honor, if that's all right. You want to disqualify Actually, Paul can say it. You want to disqualify a man for his tone, then tear out the half the New Testament. Because if I walked into churches today, many wouldn't even invite me to preach. Because I don't aim to get people celebrating. I aim to change lives. And celebrating, well, it is part of it. The goal is not applause. It's teaching, preaching, and revealing a creation, developing, and maintaining of a relationship with Jesus Christ. And if I only present the relationship with Jesus to you as something that you have and it's so great and that you're all good, but I never also tell you how great it can be through suffering. I'm not doing my job. I glory in my sufferings. And I, as Paul, I want to come back, but I have to be interviewed in a later episode. David, would you do that? Yeah. Yeah, I'll do that. All right. Cool. Love you guys. All right. Is the defense ready for their next witness? We are apparently the critic. Defense calls the critic to the stand. Please state your name and function to the court. Well, I go by many names. Discernment, caution, just trying to be careful, trying to help everyone get along. But most people just call me concerned. I'm trying to keep the peace, you know, trying to keep the peace. Let me ask you, when you decided that you did not like the David Kushin's podcast, what do you mean by did you listen to a full podcast episode before deciding it was dangerous? Nah, I didn't need to. I saw enough clips to know what spirit it was under. Did you Did you read the scriptures that David quoted? All the quotes that he quoted? Not really. I already knew what I was dealing with. I knew what it was. All I had was all I needed to do was just to hear it for a little bit to really get David's spirit. Did you contact David Cresine privately before sharing your concerns with others? Nah, I didn't need to. I didn't need to. Everyone was already talking about it. Talking about it anyway. Just so I'm getting this right. Critic. Mr. critic. You didn't go to your brother privately. You didn't test the content against the word. You judged by tone, hearsay, and popular opinion. Do you consider that discernment? Well, of course. I I just I just know when something's off, you know. So, just to be clear, you didn't listen to the full podcast. Well, not every episode. No, I mean, I listened to stories. I saw the clips. I even tuned in live a few times. I heard enough to discern the spirit behind it. Honestly, I'd like to add a verse of scripture to the record, please. Proverbs 18 and 13. He thatth a matter before he heareth it, it is folly and shame unto him. Were you familiar with that verse at the time? Well, yes, but I did hear the matter. I listened to the podcast for a little bit. I went on the live for a little bit and, you know, I I uh I talked to people who knew David. Uh, I Yeah, I I saw enough to know what it was. But did you ever truly get on your knees and ask the Lord, "God, is there truth in this that maybe I just don't want to hear? Or is there any truth in this at all?" Did you really ever sincerely get down on your knees and pray about it? No, I didn't need to. I just trust my gut. Come on. Come on. It's just social media. It's not church. It's just social media. It doesn't matter. Nothing matters, man. Come on. One more. Did you ask Lord, am I rejecting this because I don't know or I don't like just by their tone who it's coming from. No, I didn't say that. I just knew something wasn't right. You call it discernment, but you said it wasn't the spirit of God you trusted. You didn't pray about it. You didn't consult the Bible about it. You said it was your gut, not the word of God. No further questions, your honor. The prosecution ready for their cross-examination. We are, your honor. Let me be very clear. You never claimed to hate David. Correct. Well, no. I wasn't trying to tear him down. I was just concerned. I shared what I saw. I shared what I knew. That's all. Oh, that's responsible, isn't it? If something feels off, you just got to speak up, right? Well, yeah. I mean, of course. We're told to test every spirit. We're told, you know, I I knew a spirit. I I could tell by the way he talked, you know. It wasn't like something I could really do. And so you did test it. You watched the tone, listened to the language, and the way people were reacting online. That's evidence, isn't it? Well, of I think so. People need to know what when something's not safe. Just a moment, guys. Grab something. I'm just going to use this hat for the prosecution. It says if you look close enough. So, when you spoke out, it wasn't gossip. It was love. You weren't attacking. You were protecting the people. Right. Exactly. That's what I was doing. Objection, your honor. They're coaching the witness. Overruled. The prosecution has a point. You'll have your chance, lawyer. Sit back down. And frankly, defense, if your client, David Cresin, wasn't so fiery in his delivery, if he just calmed down every now and then, there might not there might not have been so many people concerned in the first place. [Music] Understood, your honor. So, just so I'm getting this right, Mr. They call you Mr. Critic. I call you Mr. Love. You heard a problem. You did your best to keep people from being hurt and people were hurt less, right? Yep. No further questions, your honor. Is the defense ready to [Music] cross-examine? We are, your honor. Let's go back to something you said, critic. You said you were protecting people. Who exactly were you protecting them from? Well, from bad influence. from getting confused, from not affirming who they are, from actually having to to do correction. We're past that. We don't need that anymore. Confused by what? The doctrine, the quotes, the scripture. Isn't it true that David works in sales and he actually does all that he can to explain things as simple as possible? Were you against what was actually being said? Or maybe the person delivering it. You had some random animus against the person delivering it. Delivering it because you would you say maybe that you interpreted his tone based on a few words that you said and your entire caricature of what you disapprove of him is based off of 1/100th of 1% of his actual content. Well, that that's not it. Your honor, do we need to compel this witness to answer the question? I'll try again. Critic, would you say that you actually know all of David's podcast actually word for word by the facts? Would you say how how well do you know the uh Psalms 23? 80% 90% 100%. Well, 100%. Why? Because I've I've read it all. So, if someone told you that Psalms 23 was completely a bad verse in the Bible, a bad chapter in the Bible, but they'd only ever read one verse of the Bible or one word from the verse, what would you tell them? Well, I told them they're crazy. They they're going to judge it off of 1%. So, just so I'm getting this right, critic, you can understand that, but you can't understand why it's so unreasonable for you to completely reject the podcast based off of 1 millionth of 1% of the actual content. I'm going to ghost you now and block you. Shocker of this century. You're just going to ghost me and you're going to ghost my client and block him because he makes a point. Objection. You will not make statements. The critic will come back to the stand and the defense will ask a different line of reasoning. Did David say something that contradicted anything that's in the Bible? No, not exactly. It just didn't feel right. So, your warning wasn't based on the content. You admitted you haven't known all the content. So, your warning about David Gresin's podcast. It wasn't based on the content. It was based on your feeling. And if you don't answer, I will have a judge compel you to answer. Yeah. I just didn't like the way it was said. It's not good to say it like that. Did the Holy Ghost ever tell you that David's podcast is an error? Or was it just your initial reaction to the whole thing that judged your entire making of it where you judged over 400 hours of content based off of five minutes? Is that more accurate? The witness will answer the question and they will be honest. I'll rephrase. How much of David's actual content have you seen on a uh to say out of a percentage- wise? How many minutes have you spent? Maybe 20. And how much time have you spent gossiping with others about it? Or do you not want to answer? I don't want to answer. No further questions, your honor. I have one last question, your honor. Are you saying critic that you didn't test the spirit? You didn't test whether it was the word of God or not. You tested the personality. You didn't pray about the content. You reacted to the way he delivered it. and that your judgment was just based on his tone, not the content, not whether not whether or not it was true. Yes. Now, I have no further questions, your honor. Is the witness is the defense ready to call their next witness? We are your We are, your honor. We call gossip the demon spirit to the stand. Please state your name in occupation for the court. Gossip, profession, misinformation, delivery method, private messages, group chats, and vague warnings. How h how do you how do you typically work? I don't confront. I circulate. I don't quote scripture. I I quote quotes of people that quoted quotes of people that they heard. I don't study. I speculate creatively. Were you involved in the judgment against this podcast? What was your involvement? Well, I started the involvement. Someone heard a clip, got emotional, and told a friend, created a group chat, and instead of actually listening to the content, I actually I actually got them to mock and make fun of David. My master was so pleased. He was so happy with me. I even got a raise. It was so great. It was just awesome. All I had to do was make I I didn't even have to focus whatsoever on David's words or his content. I just had to paint him as someone that was out of control and make everything that people looked at have nothing to do with what he was actually saying. I see. I see. Did you ever encourage anyone to contact David directly? Absolutely not. Why in the world would I do that? That would kill my influence. That would kill my power. I survive on one-sided stories, on half the truth. If truth gets involved, I lose momentum. There's no way. Actually, I use 99% truth, but there's no way they know the whole truth. I will leave out that key piece of detail. And the best Hold on. Do you Do you quote scripture? Yeah, of course I do. How do you think I get people to to submit to me so much? I get them to to gossip in long tongue like a bench a bunch of sinners. And what I do is I make them feel religious while doing it. You think the people gossiping about David's podcast are somehow doing something they know is wrong? They think they're doing God a service. I love it. It's awesome. They actually think they're doing something for God and they're just operating based on what I told them. Well, don't you care about the truth? Of course not. I don't care about the content. I don't want people to care about the content. I want them to care about how things sound, not what they mean. I I want them to uh focus on David's tone. I want them to focus on his feelings. I want them to focus on his things. I want them to focus on everything else. Dad, that's very vague. I don't know what that means. I want them to focus on everything else except truth. I don't want them focusing on truth because David isn't guilty of not preaching truth. He's guilty of violating unwritten rules that everyone fears in society and on social media. That's what he's guilty of. But as long as I can get people to focus on everything except the actual words he says, I win. So no, David, you're right. David, is David guilty though of violating the word of God? Okay. Well, the lawyer will ask that. Thank you. Man, this is difficult. Hold on, guys. Give me a second. Hold on. How long have we been going, by the way? Oh, I'm getting the rainbow circle. Isn't that perfect? 56 minutes ago. It wasn't that perfect. All right, hold on. I don't wear hats. I I don't like hats. Okay. So, hold on. So, gossip. You've heard we we we've heard about your approach, but I want to ask you a question. What is David and his podcast actually guilty of? I'm so glad you asked. Am I Do I have to answer honestly? The witness will answer honestly. They will not lie. Even though they're of the spirit of lying, they're literally Satan's minions, but they will not lie. They will tell the truth. As far as what David is guilty of, and my part in it, he's guilty of violating unwritten societal standards on social media. There's a certain way of being, a way of projecting yourself to the world on social media. It's unwritten rules no one's ever heard of. You've got to post in this certain way. You got to be this certain way. And if you don't do things a certain like you can talk about sports, you can talk about movies. You can talk about TV shows. You can talk about hunting. You can talk about fishing. You can talk about anything you want. But if you ever bring controversy on the channel, I'm going to do everything I can to twist you because those those Hold on. Let me grab uh my other person here. Where is he? I have another character to ask questions. There he is. Here, I'll turn the the gauge to this guy. What's up? Yeah. So, David is guilty of talking about things I don't want him to talk about. You think I want D? You think I want some guy in social media talking about the thing talking about the tribal things and the and and putting the putting the focus back into a relationship with Jesus Christ? There's no way. I want the focus to be on who's more right. I want the focus to be on how David's wrong. I want the focus to be on David's tone. I want it to be on how religious you can be. I want it to be I can't believe David brought up video games. I want the focus to be everything except his actual truth. Because he quotes brother Brandham hundreds and thousands of times. He quotes the Bible thousands of times. But if I can just get David to defend himself relentlessly and to defend the podcast relentlessly, I win. If I can get everyone to just not even focus whatsoever on the content, but just to focus on what the public image is and what the unwritten rules are, I win. So yeah, it's just the scope of gossip. But I use religion. How do you think I got people to kill Jesus? I convinced them that he was breaking the unwritten rules. He was bad for the public image. I don't want David talking about culture. I don't want David putting putting uh false preaching on trial. Are you kidding me? I don't want that. So, what am I going to do? I'm going to twist David's name just like your prophet said. He said that you don't have to kill you don't have to kill a man to kill his influence. All you got to do is talk evil about him. That's what I do. I actually convince people it's right. So, yeah, that's what we do. I see. Okay. Sounds like you've done this before. Oh, thousands of times. And you guys decided, I guess, to interview me because I'm your real enemy. Gossip's just one of my min minions. But I'm not going to let him talk anymore. Now it's just me. I'm your real enemy. I am being forced to say this, but I'm your real enemy. It isn't David. It isn't his tone. It isn't his approach. I'm your actual enemy. But if I can do everything I can to convince you that the problem is everything except his actual con the problem is his feeling feelings. The problem is his approach. It's his ego. It's everything. But I can just keep the approach away from what he's actually saying. I win. I've done this thousands of times. You think David is the only guy to ever do something publicly? I did this with Jeremiah. I did this with Paul. I did this with Peter. I did this with John. I did this with brother Brham. All without ever being named until now. And why do people believe you though? You're Satan. Come on. You're Satan. Horns and everything. Why would people even believe you at all? Because I don't approach people as Satan. I approach them as the voice of reason. I approach them as you can actually help God. Wouldn't you like to be equal with God? I actually approach them in a way that they think they're helping. I don't sound like gossip. I sound like wisdom. I sound like love with a warning. I sound just like [Music] God. I see. Okay. And what thoughts are you putting into the hearts of people that are listening to this that are rejecting it? Oh, I love it. I'll just paint David as arrogant. I'll paint him as a know-it-all. I'll say I'll put on his tone. I'll just get them to engage with what they what group think might be, but I'll never get it to be on truth. I love it. It's awesome. And the greatest part is that no matter how much David apologizes, no matter how many times he says he's wrong, no matter how much uh he quotes the word of God, I can still get people to reject him entirely. I see. I see. All right. Do you have anything else you'd like to say to Satan? Say, Satan? Well, yes, I would. There's a scripture I'd like to read to you guys. Yes, I quote scripture, too. And yes, I'm actually at the same time making this uh keyboard malfunction. I I don't want David to talk about this. It is 2 Corinthians 10:12. For we dare not make ourselves of the number or compare ourselves with some that command themselves, but they measuring themselves by themselves and comparing themselves among themselves are not wise. So, I just got the I got to get them to say, "Oh, you do you don't do you like David? Don't What do you think about David's podcast?" "Oh, I don't know. I don't know." And like, "Oh, and then I get the next person to say,"I don't know either." And then amongst themselves with themselves, they can all gossip about David's podcast. And then if I can just get one person that is in a position of authority over others that people respect and revere to do it too, and then the line won't be Dave is bad. The line will be if it's so good, then why does so many popular, well-known, respected people have so many negative things to say about it? I see. So, your approach, Satan, is not to actually deal with the content itself, but to attack the speaker and to try to make him look bad just pretty much through gossip. Correct. Pretty much through everything except going to David privately. Now, I would say, uh, why don't you want people going to David privately? Well, because then I don't have a game to play. I'll just lose. It's so annoying. He'll David will just apologize. He'll have an actual conversation with them. If I can just keep the battle getting David to react, it's all good. If I can just get people focused on how bad they think David is and be a skeptic unconditionally, I can win. I see. Okay. Well, fair enough. Not sure where to go. Prosecutions. Actually, we're going to have Satan say say some last things. If you could Satan, we want you to tell you tell the people what your goal is after this podcast. My goal is to get you to generalize all generalize all of your uh all of your disdain for the podcast to make it all about tone, all about delivery, all about anything and everything except the actual content. I want you to reject it. Maybe just reject the tone. do anything you possibly can to sew as many seeds of discomfort or wrongness among the people. My goal is to get David to continue defending himself even though he said that this is the last time he'll ever do it. I'm really annoyed that he's saying he's going to do it one last time. I hope he doesn't follow through on that because that would be such a hurt to my kingdom. My goal throughout this whole podcast, last statement from me, the devil. My goal for on this on this episode, my goal through this whole podcast has been to take the people's attention away from the message David is preaching and on to discrediting him as a speaker. Because if you guys ever actually listen to what he's saying, I'm [Music] doomed. No further questions, your honor. Will the prosecution call their last witness? And actually, actually, you know what? No. Prosecution. No. In this case, it's me. I'll put David on trial. I want the last one. I'll do it. The prosecution. Yeah, that's me. Actually, when you're prosecuting the podcast itself, it's not D. It's not the prosecution. It's me. Hello, I'm Satan. The prosecution calls the last witness to the sand. The volatile. Easy to be made angry. Easy to make him react. Oh yeah, he doesn't need a hat. His name is the podcast host himself, David Cresin. We're going to call him to the stand. And we're going to show you guys how he truly is not someone to be listened to. Tell me, David. And what I'm going to do now is I'm going to make David's document file glitch and change it all up on him. That's what I'm going to do. That's what I just did while he tries to fix it here. There we go. We got David, you had a you had a video called testimonies and your very Bible says you'll overcome by the blood of the lamb and by the word of their testimonies. You said I was wrong. I failed you. I've been too focused on the negative. Is that correct? Yeah, that's correct. And you said that and it got hundreds, not like a couple thousand views, right? Well, yes. And you also have cried several times, haven't you? You broke down and admitted you've been focusing on your critics too much, haven't you? Yes, I have. Well, that took courage. But here's the question. If you were wrong then, what makes you right now? You saw your podcast helps people, but by your own words, it's coming from a place of pain, frustration, emotion. So, tell me, how do you know your emotions aren't still running the show? Uh, well, because I say I was wrong and uh people have been helped. You mean like the suicidal man who messaged you? What if he had tuned in the night you snapped back at your critics? What if he saw you crying, angry, rambling? Can someone really be trusted to help others if they keep breaking down in front of the camera? I'm not breaking down. I'm being authentic. I'm being real. I don't believe that this nonsense of how the perfect image is always cast out in public should be portrayed. That is not what the Bible says. Oh, I see it now. Oh, I I I see that anger coming out. Come on. You call it obedience, but to the rest of us, it just looks like you're unstable. One day preaching, the next day apologizing, the next day fighting trolls. I mean, which version of you is real? You know what? I don't care. The version that didn't quit. That's the one. The one that doesn't care what anybody to say. I care what truth is. The one who kept going when everyone else blocked me and left me alone. When everyone had the great courage to go privately and gossip like a bunch of girls. That's what I stand for. The one who got publicly attacked and then put my critics and said that they were great people and bragged on them. The one who took his hits, forgave, said he was wrong, and kept preaching anyway. And saying, "I don't care what you do. There is nothing you can do to stop me cuz I have God himself in my heart, and you'll never stop me. You see what I did there, guys? It doesn't matter what he said. He sounds like a lunatic. That's the problem. And you just watched it happen again. He's not sincere. He's angry. I mean, come on. All it takes is asking him a simple question and then boom. Is that really what you want to listen to as a preacher? Come on. This is not ministry. It's damage. It doesn't help anybody. Come on. Prosecution rest, your [Music] honor. Is the defense ready for their uh for their cross- examination of of the podcast host? David, we are, your honor. Stupid hat. Sorry. When you said I was wrong repeatedly, David, were you stepping down or trying to show an example? Well, I've always thought that this podcast is not to say I'm right and everyone else is wrong. It's just to talk about truth. And I I never wanted it to be just me. Actually, my initial thought from the beginning is I wanted to invite preachers and pastors and fathers on. And uh I never said I was right about everything. I said if it's a quote or a scripture, it's right. But I wanted to have conversations with people. So when I said I'm wrong and I'm sorry, I'm trying I'm not trying to be special. I'm just trying to be like Jesus. You said you failed several times. Why haven't you quit? Because something in me won't stop. Because this life in me will not stop. I am not here to be popular. I am not here to make friends. I am here to preach truth. And I see no pattern in all the Bible where we forsook daily repentance for applause in every single service. I'm not against applause. I'm against celebrating like you just came out of the upper room all the time. There's ups and downs to life. And I think maybe my podcast reminded people of the reality of ministry and not just the high points. And that's why some don't like it. You said someone reached out before taking their life. Instead of killing themselves, they reached out to you. David, what what would happen if you had stayed quiet? What would have happened if you listened to the critics and the popular, well-known, respected people saying for you to stop? Well, they wouldn't have known I existed. And if I would have listened to the critics, Tommy Bushers wouldn't be alive. Noah Stevens wouldn't have been baptized. And the thousands of people that have been encouraged and helped would not have been helped and [Music] encouraged. But David, don't you have to change your tone for the public? Don't you have to be careful? Well, like I am being careful. I mean, my god, I I talk about my tone a lot. What more do people want? I make a mistake and I apologize and I try to get better. You say no one's ever. I mean, Moses struck the rock. Jesus flipped tables and I said some mean things on social media. Are you kidding me? Really? Really? That's your standard? You're against me confronting sin, but you'll confront me on social media about it. Really, I don't care how popular and wellknown you are. Wrong is wrong. Gossip is gossip. I wish people would stop gossiping like a bunch of 12-year-old girls and come to me like men and women like the Bible says or just shut up about it. You are not required by law to watch this podcast. If you don't like it, don't watch it. I don't care. I'm not here for here for people's approval. I'm here to preach the word of God and to get other people to talk about it with me. by the way. So if you don't like it, good. If you like it, good. I don't care. I'm here to preach truth and that's it. Well, David, why don't you want to protect your social image instead of doing all this? I'll tell you why. Because I I Hold on. Well, David, why did you put up with the trolls so much? Why did you talk to them so much? Because they're souls. Are we not going to preach to someone because they're mean? Are we not going to Are we not going to minister to them because they're rude? Yes. I knew the trolls were just trying to get me to react. I knew they were just trying to humiliate me. But it reminds me of the story where the uh there's an old man with a bike shop and a young man that would come in and they had a nice relationship and then they caught the young boy still in the bike and they said, "He stole this bike from you, sir." And the young boy said, and then and then the man says, "He didn't steal it. I gave it to him. You trolls, you critics. You didn't humiliate me without me knowing. I knew what you were doing the whole time. I'm not going to stop you from failing." I had someone uh reach out to me and tell me uh you know that delete your podcast, you're so creepy, all different things. And then I was going to talk about it and they said, "You shouldn't do that. That's not why socially." I don't care about wise socially. I care about the word of God. And they reached out to me and said, "But they're trying to troll you." I said, "Yeah, and I'm still going to talk about it." Then they said, "I'm so sorry. I was wrong. I was the one that sent all that telling you to delete your channel and everything." And they said, "I understand if you'll block me." And I said, "Why would I block you? You're just a son or daughter of God. We all make mistakes." And then later that same critic came to me asking me for advice when someone had created a group chat to mock and make fun of them. They said what? They asked me for advice. What do you do when people are making fun of you? But if I would have just don't listen to the trolls, brother Bham said that walk unconscious of criticism. Never talk about your trolls. Then I wouldn't have been able to help that person. Well, you've heard it from his own mouth. Guys, let me ask the jury. Are you more comfortable with a preacher who smiles and says nothing, or a son of God who shakes under the weight of a real burden? Do you want a man who never cries, who never causes controversy, or one who never quits? Do you want safe or surrendered? Because if you think this podcast sh should end, who will you answer to when the next next man reaches for the edge? when the next man is going to kill himself. And by the way, that Tommy Bushier, he had no connection to any message church. He didn't even go to church. He just was my friend on Facebook for 10 years. What happens when the next guy like him is looking for someone to talk to? But you win against the social image. And then I go according and then and then I go according to what the critics say and they uh I go according to what the critics say like, "Oh, I'm sorry guys. I can't help you not kill yourself. I can't baptize you know Stevens. I was too controversial. I hurt the popular people's feelings." And none of them came to me directly. No. in an honest way. Anyway, oh, I can't wait to put arguing tactics on trial. Sorry, that's another live. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. No further questions. If there's anything you'd like to say in the last David, what would what would it be? There is I'm fine with you not watching this podcast. Maybe it's not your thing. Whatever. I mean, Brother Trevor just did a podcast episode with a fine uh couple. I didn't even know it existed. And they were really nice. They're above really. They were happy. completely different style than me. They're awesome. Brother Jason Mars does one. Brother Joewood the second does one. Uh there's a young lady, I forgot her name. She's blonde. She does one, too. We all have different styles, but you know what? I'm better at everyone else than something. Seriously, I am. I'm very talented. You know what? I'm better that than everyone else being David Cushain. And you are better at being you than everyone else, too. So, stop making group identity with how you accept or reject something. I admit I' I've been wrong. I've made it more about uh rightness than a relationship with Jesus Christ. But I am going to bring it back to the real focus. Not on being right, not on defending myself, but on what contributes and helps a relationship with Jesus Christ the most. Not a relationship with public acceptance or social acceptance, but a relationship with Jesus Christ. No further qu No further questions, your honor. All [Music] right. Is the clos is the prosecution ready for their closing statement? We are, your honor. Put a bunch of nonsense. Man, this guy really knows how to lie. I mean, I'm pretty good, but that that that was impressive, honestly. All right, boys and girls, men and women, they and them, all the weird people and the great people, whatever you guys want. We are not here today to question whether this podcast helps someone or not. That's not the issue. We are here to decide if something so volatile, so emotional, so public, should have ever been trusted with souls in the first place. The witness admitted himself. He's broken down on live streams. He's lashed out. He's apologized. He's cried. What? David, why are you using Satan? Because he's the real prosecution of this podcast. That's the real one. It's not you. It's not me. It's demon power. That's why. And yes, he's also read testimonies. But emotion is not the test of the calling. Fruit alone is not fruit alone is not the proof of safety. The truth is this pod the truth is this podcast feels unstable because its host is unstable. One moment he's repenting, the next he's raging, the next he's preaching. And that's not what the bride needs. The bride needs consistency. The bride needs ministers under control, not someone who uses fire, who uses who who uses just apologizing if it does wrong to cover his instability. So we ask the court not to ignore the impact, but to weigh the danger of unchecked emotion in a spiritual position. Good fruit doesn't justify a reckless tree. David's reckless. He gets angry way too fast. Come on. Look at the record show. This podcast is not false because it's controversial. It's false because it's uncontrolled. It's false because it doesn't adhere to the standard to the unwritten rules on social media and in the social sphere that I gave to you. But don't worry, I gave it to you and made you think it was God, but it's actually me. And for that reason, it should have never existed. See you guys in the next podcast. Is the defense ready for their closing statement? We are, your honor. Members of this court, you've seen it all. It's me. It's just David. You guys saw who the real enemy is. It's not you. It's not me. It's Satan. You've watched me rage. This is my closing statement. You've watched me rage. You've heard me repent. You've listened to the testimonies and you've seen the twist. I never claimed to be perfect. I've only ever claimed one thing. I've only ever claimed a few things, but one of them is God told me to do this, I believe, and I've obeyed. If obedience looks messy, good. If it looks controversial, good. It's always been controversial. It's always been messy. It's always violated social image standards. Ask Moses. Ask Paul. Ask Jesus. Ask brother Brandham. And you guys say, "Oh, well, the tapes are not an open channel for live arguments." Then what is Brother Brandham saying? Any man can stand here next to the pulpit and stand by my side and challenge me on anything I've ever said. What was that? Because I believe that what I'm saying is absolute truth. And if and I I believe that I defend truth and I'm doing my best. And part of being right is sometimes you're wrong. It's almost as if I'm human. If they Moses, Paul, Jesus, they broke tablets. They rebuked churches. Jesus flipped tables, but he never backed down. And that's what I've done. I didn't quit. I didn't perform to some social image. I didn't create curate a ministry built to be accepted. I didn't I didn't change I' I've had people send in stuff saying, "Oh, well, we don't want your next pod your last sermon. We don't want your last thing. We don't want your last We don't want your tr your preaching stuff. We want entertainment. We want drama." Yeah, go to Netflix for that. That's not here. I do this to preach the truth of the gospel. That's why I obey the calling of the Lord Jesus Christ. So now you decide not whether I'm loud or not. In other words, not about my tone, but whether I told the truth. Are you upset with my tone? Is what you're upset with my tone. I or it's just Have you actually checked it with truth? If all you can see is the emotion and the tone and everything else. If all you can see is the negative and you get mad at me for talking about the negative all the time. If all you can see is the negative and you don't see the people who got saved from suicide who baptized someone by God's grace. If all you see is the wrong, maybe that says more about you than it does about me. You say I was too much. Maybe, probably, actually. I mean, so was everyone else has preached, right? But I'd rather be too much for God than not enough for the people who needed him. And if I have to crucify my social image and humiliate myself publicly to bring trolls back to Jesus Christ, I'll take that. I'll I'll take that every time. Now you guys have heard it. All that the verdict is yours. Whether or not you guys decide this podcast should continue or not is in your own mind because the truth is you're not required to watch the podcast. So what are going to hold me guilty of the podcast not continuing? This is it's different than a pulpit. I'm not claiming I'm right about everything. It's up to you whether or not you choose to continue listening. But as for me, I'd rather die than stop. There is nothing Satan can possibly do to stop me because I believe God led me here and I love it. I have a lot of fun doing this honestly and I love disappointing the devil and uh I'm a son of God and I will all I will never just point you to the fun parts of the relationship with Jesus Christ and the easy parts. I'm going to introduce you to the beginning, middle, and ending, the suffering, the growing, the daily repentance, the daily dying of a relationship with Jesus Christ. I know I'll be unpopular, but that is a compliment to any preacher. If you're popular, that's an insult. But if you're if you're controversial, unpopular, I take that as a compliment. End of closing statement. The arguments have been made. The evidence has been heard and you've seen passion, pain, repentance, and conviction. The prosecution says this podcast is unpredictable, emotional, and unsafe. The defense says it's biblical, burdened, and bearing fruit. So, what is it? A problem or a calling? This court won't answer that for you because this was never just about a podcast. It was about how you respond when God speaks through a platform that you didn't expect. So the verdict doesn't belong to a jury. It belongs to you. Make up your own mind. Whether or not you actually decide whether you decide you like it or you don't. I'm just I'm I'm not going to whether you decide you like it or you don't, David's not going to stop doing it unless God leads him not unless God leads him to. Look at the fruit. Look at the cost. And then ask yourself honestly, are you rejecting this podcast because it's wrong or because it made public social standards uncomfortable? Court is adjourned. What you do with the truth is now your responsibility. Love you guys. Hope you enjoyed that. I will see you guys on the next episode. I love you very much. Good night. [Music]