################################################################################ START OF FILE: 2023-08-05 - What do you mean by 0005 with Brother Trevor Emond - Trevor Emond.txt ################################################################################ SERMON DETAILS ======================================== Date: 2023-08-05 Title: "What do you mean by" #0005 with Brother Trevor Emond Speaker: Trevor Emond Church: What Do You Mean By Type: Church Service Duration: 2h 3m Language: English URL: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84B2mSuPJJ4 ======================================== Description: "What do you mean by" #0005 with Brother Trevor Emond In this episode we ask Brother Trevor Emond What do you mean by "The Message" What do you mean by "saved" And others!!! TRANSCRIPT ======================================== what's up guys how's it going welcome to live should be good Lord willing for the Trevor hello what's up Addison how's it going we'll welcome everybody to live everybody's gonna join them but Trevor will join them we'll start so should be good Lord willing I'm in the closet today because um I might filling out by I have to repeat this a few times but in a closet today because uh we are actually at Airbnb for the weekend from my brother-in-law Dominique um for his birthday pretty good but I'm glad you're doing good Edison very good welcome everybody to the live yes brother Trevor will join here in a little bit um hello mayday Mariah hey brother Trevor all right another trip if you want to go ahead and request to join and we'll start out hi everybody hello hi everybody excited tonight got my brother Trevor with us hey Dominic what's up hello my brother Trevor whenever you're ready go ahead and join or I just request to join rather I guess let me say we'll go live should work except come on please work hey everybody hey how you doing good how are you doing great we're at Airbnb for the weekend from your brother Joshua's her brother brother-in-law Dominique's birthday oh cool yeah some of the closet nice I may have to hey um I I may have to like go outside or something like that after uh all of my kids get home I don't have an office so so it works yeah I was actually thinking about like this is the first time I've ever done something like this so I'm like yeah I'm gonna hold my phone for like two hours because I don't have a tripod but just a desk I do but like I don't know anyway it's all right you're fine if my arm falls off we'll we'll end we'll end the live fair enough fair enough it's fun thank you for joining it's awesome to have you here with me yeah yeah great to be here Phillip Bryant who's in Canada right now at a camp oh cool great yeah a lot of people Mr Williams others Trevor Olivia Caleb I can't I can't listen everybody but a lot of people yeah there's just a lot of people here and the previous live at this point is over 400 views so there's gonna be a lot more after this so Olivia we got some Norwegians on behind Norwegians hello Norwegians I don't have any adjustable regular chair foreign yeah I'm I'm your guest man so okay so basically uh you know what do you mean by it and someone when someone put in the question uh you know what to you is the best of indication for them being a prophet you know I immediately thought of uh you know there's the obvious answer of you know Revelation sense that the milk f156 and we know the scriptures as message kids but you know I believe that we should have like a uh personal revelation of course and probably no more scriptures and different ways of explaining just hanging personal to us and not just another thing that message kids say to get people to not want to get people to stop talking them about it you know right yeah I could spoken like a man with some experience yeah exactly yeah so like when you say like oh I believe you're gonna communicate a profit like you know that's the name of the name of the podcast what do you mean by that what does that mean exactly yeah um so I guess you know we have to ask ourselves what do we mean by Vindication and I think that's one of the things that that's one of the words we throw around as as message Believers it's like oh yeah he's Vindicated profit it's like okay so so what is what does it mean to be Vindicated like what is that what what is that you know um I was like you know kind of what brother Daniel Andes has said you know he talks about the seven truckloads in in uh in Africa and you know by because of one prayer there were seven truckloads of cots and stretchers and things like that and he's like so you know just find me somebody else who could who has that kind of results and so that that's that's something about it but I think if we look at what the random said was his Vindication like that's that's kind of a big deal is you know I mean he talked about the two signs just like Moses had two signs Moses had the the sign in the hand and then he picked up the snake you know and and so brother Branham had two signs and and um that the angel gave him when he was uh in 1946 when he was at his cave um he was actually in a cabin near his cave we had we had some fun in Texas um we had half of us as uh one one year we had half of us as team cave and half of us is team cabin um you know where brother Brenham actually was when the angel was was uh was was talking to him but um but so as the angel was giving him his commission he tells him he's going to give him two signs that he had a sign in the hand and that so as he would pray for people he would he would grab them by the hand and then he would see on his hand various bumps or patterns or whatever it was that it you know and and he he learned what each one of those things was and so he could tell you what was wrong based on that sign that he had in his hand and so then he said and then the angel told him and then it'll come to pass he'll know the secrets of their hearts and so then we see prayer line after prayer line after prayer line where brother Brandon is Discerning the secrets of their hearts now doesn't mean that other people can't have discernment but who has had deserve at that level and and and never been wrong you know to I mean even brother Collins um my pastor some years ago would talk about he went to one of other Brandon's meetings and he was sitting there and heard brother Brandon say if I ever say anything to you that's wrong you know don't don't believe me and so this woman comes up in this prayer line and brother Brenham tells her who she is and where she lives and the two women sitting in front of brother Collins in that service said oh he missed it that's not where she lives she lives at this place or whatever and so brother Collins was like okay this man said if he said anything wrong I shouldn't believe him but these women say that's not where this this woman lives so anyway he starts investigating he finds the lady that was in the prayer line and he asks her and he says hey this is what happened these ladies said that's not where you live and she's like oh I just moved a week ago and I haven't told those ladies yet so so you you we have these like these are the things that brother Bradham tells us was his Vindication I mean and then on top of it we have you know we have Pillar of Fire on top of that we have cloud and you know I mean you can dispute some of these things and many people do dispute these things and try to find errors and like but the overwhelming volume here that we have like it at some point in time you know it's like hey um these all indicate one One Direction right like they're they're all star they're they're they're all starting to tell us like hey this is maybe a Ministry you should you should look at you know and so the Supernatural is just foreign Wonders that are happening in his ministry that we look at and so it's like hey that just grabs our attention right and and so then okay now that our attention is grabbed like and that was kind of the point what brother Brandon would talk about is that hey these these these God gave Moses these two signs so that people would believe him God gave me two signs why so the people would would believe me and so um hey my friend Willie will from Brazil is on but um anyway so so then then on top of that and I think kind of what you had said um when we talked about this a little bit earlier you know you had said hey you know to talk about you know what it what it means to you and and kind of my testimony and you know okay what is why do I believe this message as much as I did as I do and it's like so we can go back to like I said those signs and wonders but then we get into Malachi four five and six that we do have a scripture that's pointing to hey here there's a prophet that's supposed to come before the great and Dreadful day of the Lord okay so if we believe the scripture at all we're looking for a prophet to come that's it wasn't John the Baptist we can easily show how John the Baptist came in the spirit of the power of Elijah but how he scripturally we can show how he turned the hearts of the fathers to the children but not the children of the father so we know there should be another coming of the spirit of Elijah just as it came in Elijah Elijah John the Baptist we know that the Revelations 11 Elijah's is to come so we're there's there's here's an Elijah that's supposed to come before the great and Dreadful day of the Lord so there's a scripture looking for that most Christians aren't looking for anyone so well why not you know I mean and so usually when I'm talking to people I'm just like hey look this is what the scripture says if you don't believe it's William brand I'm like I can show you signs and wonders that certainly point to hey there's there's a minister here you should at least look at you know but hey if but but the idea is look you pick man like find somebody but don't just disregard the scripture here because Malachi 4 5 and 6 is a thing and so yeah and and there's and it's a thing for a reason you know just like the whole book of Revelation you know all these Christians out there I mean my my own chiropractors like he was at his church was doing this uh bible study on the Book of Revelation and he's just like man you know it's just and I'm sure you've heard this before you know it was just like John ate some bad pizza before you know before he went to bed and had dreams that night and then wrote them all down it's like I'm sorry that's what the Book of Revelation is to you like yeah like like did God give us the Book of Revelation for a reason or not and if he gave it to us for our good like it's like the Bible you know all of scripture is for our good and if it is divinely inspired then there should be a reason that it's there and we should understand it and so okay then we have Revelation 10 7 which talks about revealing the Mysteries to us and tying up all these loose ends as as as brother Brandon talks about so like so there becomes that now now is when it starts getting like really good for me because um I don't know as as a lot of people I I I'm a bit I'm a bit on the intellectual side I'll I'll just confess that um not that not that I'm not spiritual at all but like I like things to be logical I like things to make sense I like to understand things and after having studied the church ages and the seals and seeing how brother Branham has shown you know those two trees um the True Vine and the false Vine going through history like I can't unsee that you know and then it answers so many questions I mean atheists are like well I can't believe in God because look at how many people you know the Catholic Church killed you know they killed 68 million people and we're like yeah yeah they did yeah yeah God you know like but but atheists don't understand that because they like they because well they don't have the message they don't have a messenger showing them and exposing you know that that this false Vine was supposed to try it was wanting to try to look like the True Vine but it wasn't but now because we have prophetic Insight like we see this and to me that's what's so that's what's so moving and so like energizing to me because now like I like I feel like I understand history so much better because of the message and so I feel like all of these things you know that we have in the message just make they make history make sense they make who I am make sense they make where I'm going make sense they make who Jesus is make sense and it's just like so we have like we have an abundance of overwhelming vindicate let's just use that word Vindication that's that's the sign in the hand the that's the discernment of spirit the discernment of the people's hearts we've got pillar fire we've got the cloud we've got all of these things that happened in brother branham's Ministry that guy was showing us we're like just a perfect type of Moses just a perfect type of Paul you know and and then I look at what everything that he said and when everything that he said makes more sense than everything anybody else says it's like oh hey man that's amazing and so to me it's like well what are you gonna find that's better than that as we go back to like there's got to be somebody that's going to be Malachi four five and six and so we have Vindication of signs and wonders we have the two signs we have all of these things and then when I look at what he says it it just makes the word truly opens it up like we would expect it to do because of what Revelations 10 7 says in the days of the voice of the seventh angel when he shall begin to sound the mystery of God should be finished and so you know to me I just feel like oh like the Book of Revelation isn't a complete mystery to me anymore so how is he how how then is this not the Fulfillment of Revelations 10 7 and if he's the Fulfillment of Revelation 10 7 then he is the Fulfillment of Malachi four five and six which I could take time and explain but um you know maybe that's not exactly what we're doing is great it's all good you guys if anybody had any uh outputs in the chat said he has any questions about anything that he's saying like uh clarifications or what about this what about that put it in the chat and we can we can answer those things you know this is meant to be like a you know explanation and uh it's all awesome stuff because we were raised in it I was raised in my whole life and you believe in it because we know the scriptures but I believe until it's actually in our hearts we don't really know why we believe it and it's good to uh you know like what yeah go ahead and continue with the what we were saying you know on on that point like what you're saying like you know I remember um you know I I got I got my kids involved in a homeschool soccer team you know generally Christian based there's some Catholics and you know wasn't exclusive like you know you had to sign a statement of faith or anything to play soccer but it was you know generally it's a home school it's usually generally a Christian environment in this area so um one of the reasons that I wanted to um you know I wanted uh I wanted to do that is I wanted them to be exposed to other Christians that were not message Believers and it's just like you know well in some circles that can be pretty radical it's like oh my goodness like you know exposing your children it's like well you know what they just they just need that you know and so um so they would so they you know so here now they're making friends and it's it was a great environment um oh okay I see this question Olivia and I will try to David like write that down okay look at my channel right back yeah because I was like oh I'll take a picture of it but then I actually have to love the closet that our brother's in tonight um yeah nobody asked other questions yet until we can get Olivia's written down really yeah yeah he's in an Airbnb um they're on vacation I guess for Dominique for his birthday yeah Airbnb for Dominic's birthday no home but they had a lot of times so so he's in the Airbnb prayer closet yes I'm gonna find a closet and you guys are set up on a uh on a chair and a nightstand and the earbuds a lamp sure this is very cool let me see if you put in a perspective importance of not just having the end knowledge of the message and believing versus having a true experience where the message lives in you that's great um okay so continuing on this thought you know so then um because what I'm demonstrating is just trying to understand like um like like the the I'll say it this way I don't really mean it this way but the biases that you have because you've been raised in the message I'm just gonna put it in that way although I think biases isn't exactly the the right word for that but like like the blinders or the things that you don't know and so so um Zion and Azariah are you know they're they're have they're making friends Christian friends in the soccer team and then um you know so and then they start obviously they start noticing differences it's like okay we believe slightly different than this guy and we believe slightly different than these people and and so then they sort of ask okay like Hey Dad we want to witness to this guy you know we want he's a really great guy and he's you know so much fun and so I want to tell him about this and I want to tell him about that you know and and I was like okay so how would you how would you do that you know and Zion was just like oh well I would just tell them about the church ages and I was like you know he's like I just go through the church ages and I was like yeah you have to establish that that seven churches are ages first he's like wait what do you mean I was like yeah he's gonna have no idea he's like what do you mean like I was like yeah most most just Christians just see it in seven churches they don't see it as seven Church ages so you're gonna have to establish that their age seven Church ages first before you can use you know that there's a messenger to each age to show that we have a prophet at the seventh age like like there's a so there's all of this understanding that that you have because you've just been raised in it and and then but what you don't have is what you don't always have I'm I'm not you know I'm not making total blanket statements here but in general yeah you know like what you don't have is you don't have the I the you know I was pre preaching on this in Norway and I was just like you know to say Hey you know um praise God you know we've been called out of denominations it's like well so okay you uh David you you've been called out of denominations it's like well okay but have you ever set foot in a denominational church it's right you know so I mean it's just like funeral or you know like um but I mean so many of us haven't even been to a a even a shirt like a church service in a denominational church so it's really so then it's like okay well I don't have the I don't then at what point in time do you have like the ability to say hey this is amazing but I've been called out a denomination when you're like I've never been in a nomination and I don't know like I conceptually I understand what you're saying about the nomination but like like how is this such a great thing because I've I've not been caught it's like well in reality you have been called out of denomination and there's a spirit of denomination you need to stay out of denomination even in denominations that we try to like if there's a spirit of denomination there's a spirit of nicolaitanism and and it's those spirits that are being exposed by the message and it's the that's the message I mean that's like a huge part of the message is to show us that it that that the devil is trying to create a religious system that is um you know that that that we can worship under but that's not what God wanted God wanted a relationship between us and him and so one of the things the message is doing is calling us out of those systems but those systems were really powerful and and so when you've been you know raised in the message it feels like you're already pulled out of denomination but what you need to begin to understand is is that actually what he's doing is exposing spirits that started back there in the Ephesian age and are still very alive and well today and would love to denominate us message people just as much you know that's that the devil would love us to substitute a relationship with Christ for a doctrinal understanding for a particular Pastor for a particular this or that and say well I'm good because I have ascribed to church a church B Church C Doctrine a Doctrine B Doctrine C and those are the things that this message is exposing in spirit form now those are named Pentecost and Baptist methodists and Presbyterian and brother Branham you know goes through all of those things but to take it down and recognize really what's happening that's that's a that that is that like the next step like that takes it from like okay I know how to say the message speak but I need it like I and so so now maybe like we go into Olivia's question like it what like what can you read that question to me again yes yes it is can you put into perspective the importance of not just having head knowledge of the message and believing it versus having a true experience where the message lives in you yeah so I think that's a perfect segue into that you know it's like so head knowledge of the message and and like exactly what what you're I think titling this you know it's like what do you mean you know which I think is great you know um um to start to start actually yep I'm repping the I'm repping the byc 2023 I thought it was appropriate um so but anyway um I think uh I think it's just a perfect segue to to really talk about that because what what we're illustrating here I think is there's a lot of things that as you've been raised in the message there's a lot of message speak out there that it's like you gotta stop and start analyzing like wait what does that mean it's like it's the things that I've always known you know it's just like you know and what's funny is like as a parent like raising children there's just things that I've assumed that my children knew and they didn't always know and it's just like well how could you not know that like your best Believers like like so it kind of goes both ways but so so to start analyzing you know and and I was always just like man I don't know where where are the holes you know like what have I what have I not taught but but the things that you do know the things that you have been taught to start analyzing them for deeper meaning instead of just saying okay I understand this I understand this and yeah we you know all of this all of the things that are just sayings to you like I think it'd be very important and especially as you know many of you you young people are getting older and you know as you're Crossing 18 19 20 like yeah you really need to start understanding not just saying the things but it's like wait why am I saying that and like I I Don't Mind questions if they're honest-hearted questions and we're not like throwing doubt in there too like you know to have to have good honest questions and say hey I'm gonna dive into this and I don't maybe understand this fully and so why what is this what does this actually mean because we're saying these things I think that's a huge that's a huge part of Discovery and an honest inquiry that that we need to have which starts the process of getting it from your head and down in into your heart um at the youth camp in Norway that I was just at uh the week after byc um uh the Lord put it on my heart I mean just just kind of inspiration there in the pulpit and I said we have all these we have words but we need the word right the word is comprised of a bunch of words but if if it's not connected to the heart of God if our Doctrine isn't bringing us closer to Christ then we're we're missing out on so much fulfillment and so much joy in the word and all of it is is just words that were just mechanically living without without the spirit of Christ making these things alive and real so that's what I guess I would say is like like we need to be we need to be looking for hey how can I Lord I I want this to be reality I don't want to just like man I heard I heard I heard brother Paula LaFontaine on a YouTube short that um uh that I just saw this week and it was just like he said something about like do you think the you think that guy's sitting there at a bar is miserable he's like not compared to someone who's serving Christ without the spirit of without the spirit of Christ who's doing who's just doing all the things who just knows all the sayings and does all the stuff but hasn't connected like the why to their heart hasn't connected like hey this message came not to like it came to call me out a denomination but it came to pull me out of denomination into a relationship with Christ so if I'm missing a relationship with Christ if I'm missing and again like these aren't just words like this is emotion this is this is reality this is like down in your soul like grabs you and goes yeah I yes I like Lord I'm on board like count me in this is amazing you know like that that kind of feeling should should come into you know your walk in the in this message because and so that it so that comes off of just words and it comes into word so it's like but when I'm when I say word like it's not just messagey speak but what I mean by that is like hey it's a heart it's a it's a it's the real quality of the meaning of the words what's behind the words and um you know like I think I think I think I use that at byc um okay well yeah well we're brother Nathan brother Nathan texted me one day and he says and the text said you have five minutes you know and so of course I I I knew what he like that there was no question mark it just said you have five minutes and I and so of course I chose to take that the wrong way and mess with him a little bit you know and and I said well I guess I better start running you know but uh but like but like it was just words right and you could take it in various ways because it was just words but once I knew the heart you know if I knew the heart of the author of those words then and you know because it's more than just one line you know like hey suddenly I know I know his intent behind those words and and and and that's a that's a very different thing so I know he's actually asking me a question that hey I'd like to call you if you have five minutes to talk that's what he meant by it but so so the words without knowing the author without having the heart man that's that's just a real problem and and you can get like you know and and and so in this in the same way and this is what I think I'm really concerned about particularly with young people is is there's so many that are just so afraid of God and there's so like the messages just rulesy and it's all you know it's just all this stuff that we just have to do and if we don't do it it's like you know man it's curtains and hell for you so so like okay like but you're totally connected you're disconnected from the heart of God because this message is bringing us to Christ it and and that's where it's like well man like that's that's that's the point and and people are like like wanting to leave the message for Christ like yeah that actually makes no sense like because the The more I've dove into this message and understood the doctrines of this message the more Christ has been opened and Made Alive to me and it it is the Mighty God unveiled before us you know and so I think that's um that's a huge thing you know so that so I think that to answer Olivia's question you know like you know obviously we need the Holy Spirit we need we need that we need that experience but I think also like along with that experience we need to grow and mature in the word and when we say that it's not just knowing stuff but it's understanding from the heart the mind of God and the the will of God and the Heart of God because his word does show us what his heart is and it and it just all comes down to that you know it all comes down to love I mean all the Commandments it's like what's the first and greatest commandment it's like well Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all your heart you know um yeah so Olivia's like like tagging on to that it seems that a lot of people raised to believe the message think merely believing it reading their Bible and listening to tapes means they're okay but bypass the importance of the new birth like yeah talk about it um yeah and I think that's what I'm saying is it's like it's so that's so that's the that's the denomination that the message is actually calling us out of like that's what the message is exposing is the is the propensity in our own human heart to say hey because I do x i therefore I'm good so because I believe the message I'm I'm fine because I believe brother Branham is a prophet I'm fine um because I listen to tapes or because my pastor is so and so like hey I'm I'm fine like that that puts me in the right group but it's not about your group like that's the that's that is what this message is saying that's the heart of this message so the words of this message saying come out of denominations come out of her my people as she be partakers of her sins the heart of God is saying that that's that's behind those words is saying don't judge yourself by your groups or by the things that you do but what it is is are are you getting to know me is this a relationship with Jesus Christ and is this has this like and as I said this over the last month you know Jesus had a birth and we have a new birth and you know like and that's another thing this message is is and and what has really been opening like I've really been into spoken word at the Original Seed lately I know I know that makes me crazy six hours of it right yeah I've just lost everybody now right because it's just like wow brother forever like can't identify with you you are into like you know yeah I've been into you know whatever the thing is and you're telling me you're into spoken words the original seat look I have other things I'm into too a few times I took a big long hike um before before camps and I listened to to that while I was while I was hiking um and and just just kind of got into it but that the whole idea of like and this is a this is another thing that makes it just seem so real and so alive to me is that it actually is about the New Birth it is about has the word been born in your heart and and that's the connection to the word like you're raising the message to do all the right things to to wear the right clothes and to do the right things and that's all for your protection and that's all to train you and mold you but at some point in time like all of the things that you do need to become reality you need to be get you need to have that moment where you understand I my parents have been teaching me all of these things but now I see why and I want these things for myself because I see the heart of God because I see the heart of God through these things and and and it has and it has captured my it has captured my imagination it just captured my my vision it is captured every you know every you know just just as a just as as you fall in love with somebody and you're just like uh that's all I can see it's all I can think about that's all like it like the word of God needs to come and be that to you at some point in time where all of the things that you're doing like have become a part of you in a way that you're like it is so second nature to me to do those things now because I just love it so much because I see the heart of God and I'm like Lord I'm in yeah let's do this and and and that's that birth that you have and then once you have that birth like that's really changing your life and and then you do listen to the message you do believe the message you do read your Bible you do listen to tapes but but it's not external anymore but now it's coming from the heart and and that's just such a like that's such a huge thing and then it and it takes it from this fear base like it's like oh if I don't do these things I'm going to be excommunicated and ostracized and you know the Lord is gonna hate me and the Lord actually hates me right now because I still like I just I struggle with these things and it's like whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa like no like what we want is a burst what we want is is is the word in our hearts and and it is the word and and this message is the word this message is showing us you know what he means when he says you have five minutes like that's that's what like because we have the Bible right the Baptist set the Bible the Pentecost said the Bible they had the Bible in 1200s they had a Bible in 1500s you know like but we gotta have we but we needed the meaning behind it we needed the heart of God that was behind it and that's what Revelation 10 7 gives us is the heart not it it's not just understanding but it's understand it's meaning if that makes sense yes so like being a message kid going to church wearing the red things saying the right things all these different things how do we know we haven't connected you know it being in our heart versus just doing all the right things I think that well yeah it's a different question so what do you mean by no yeah that's right I'd say what do you mean by uh there you go but yeah how do you how do you tell the difference I think I think you that's that's going to be a a bit of introspection in your heart and and you know you have to ask yourself it's like I mean obviously we know that there's an experience of a birth that that you need to have and that just changes everything so it's like well have I had that and many of us have had experiences and things like that but I would say like look at your life oh like like look at your life over over a period of time like look at your life over the last three months six months one year are you growing in Grace or are you not like are you growing in the message are you like is your heart becoming more connected to Christ or is it just still kind of like you're still like very very much up and down and I don't I don't mean falling like you know a lot of us are you know try to overcome addictions with different things and all kinds of issues that that you might deal with so I'm not talking about like just falling and and struggling with fleshly struggles but are you growing in are you growing in the faith or not not just in your knowledge not but but in your heart that's what we're looking for is is like or is this becoming real or is it just still a bunch of head knowledge and I think you should be able to know that you should be able to point back to a time where you could say you know what I I maybe I didn't even know it at the time but now I can look back to that moment and think man Lord I've been different and because so that's for me like when I receive the Holy Spirit um it was Easter Sunday night 1997. you know everybody was at the altar except me I think like all the guys that I was hanging out with like they were all at the altar and I was standing in the back and I was like Lord should I be at the altar or shouldn't I like everybody else's like but I'm living a fairly decent life and then the Lord brought me the one thing like I was I was kind of dating this girl that was a Pentecostal girl she wasn't really a message believer in yeah thank God uh that didn't that didn't work exactly so so but he's you know the Lord's just witnessed in my heart he's like hey you know what are you what are you doing here uh you know you've got this this girlfriend and you know that that's not you know certainly not what your parents want certainly not what I want you know and so in my heart I was just like okay like I just yield it to the Lord right there right then and there and that was the last thing that I had you know everything else I had yielded I had surrendered to God already except for that one thing and as soon as I said okay Lord here you go like in my heart this is over man just the presence of God just fell on me and I was like wow this is this is amazing you know and and it's like well I haven't had I had experiences like that for sure but man I could just look like six months later I was like Wow am I different a year later people were like oh man you sound like a preacher I'm like what no you know and that's not you know certainly that's not the mark of you know like like that's not the mark of being filled with the Holy Ghost and suddenly you sound like a preacher um I don't mean to to say that right but the same course I I could see the evidence change in my life where where I was just a good message kid before but the direction of my life was still like who was in control of that ah that was still pretty much me but how old were you when that happens 18. awesome and we had been in the message since I was probably about eight um and started going to message search when I was 10 or so um you know so I had I I you know so I I was I would still consider myself as having been raised in a message but I do remember being in a Pentecostal Church um uh uh uh and and things like that so I still have like a bit of you know the not like like I can I just I have that experience to go oh yeah that's what yeah I remember that when I was five like it's back there but I do remember and and it really gives me something to connect to but but otherwise I you know generally I would say I was I was raised in the message as well um but yeah so from that moment I could like I could it it's a it's just a question of the heart and it's a question of looking at your heart and saying is it head knowledge or is it hard for me and and being real honest with yourself so I you know I got to the point where I looked you know look I told the Lord I you know I yielded I yielded at that moment but it still took me so that was April there was a camp in Pennsylvania that I think was in like June like mid-june that's when I finally broke up with this girl that I told the Lord like it was over in April but I just didn't have the courage you know and there were parts of you know there was like hey you know what you know what guy you know wants to pick up with the girl you know when you're enjoying that and you know all of that you know I I I was enjoying having a girlfriend you know and all of all of that you know some of it yeah it wasn't just about her some of it was just about the social status of having a girlfriend some of it was just how nice it is to have a girlfriend like look yes yeah yeah what a jerk but I mean it's like that's part you know it's life man it's part of it of course but so so it's like it's so in my flesh like there were still things that I had you know that I and certainly many other issues that I had to overcome as well but in my heart like the direction the direction was coming from a different Source then then where where it had been prior to that and I could just tell like Lord you've really done something in my heart and you really changed me and and and and I'm and I'm so like and as I look back over the last year like I'm so Overjoyed Lord like this is amazing um because my life has been enriched by everything that you've done in my heart it's great so like how do we know the uh the difference though like because I counted like from somewhere from 30 to 45 camps I've been to how do we know like I remember the David we were mentioned this at Camp last year um Having the Holy Spirit in your flesh your spirit your soul if you know we can have the right feelings how would we know we've actually got something compared to just like you know going there feeling something good going the ultra crime and then going back home making some mistakes feeling terrible and then you know getting in how do we know we've actually got something compared to just feeling something yes that's a great question um wish I had like a concrete answer for that you know um but but like it's a it's a journey man like if if there was a like it's it's a it's always a growth and Grace it's always a growing growing in the Lord and I think like like you just you you feel whether that there's that anchor there there's that thing that's like well I I just can't I can't this will never let me go I could never really actually get away from this and I don't really want to but I see where maybe I struggle in My Flesh and things like that I mean you know I will like I will say even like I can I can point back to that Easter Sunday 1997 as as that time when that change happened and it's and the more I I'll put it this way like the more I um the more I'm growing in the Lord the more firm that becomes in my heart like yeah that was the point man like that's when God really did something because I can see it like you know but but does that mean like I never doubted like Lord like I am such a loser and I fall so many times maybe I actually don't have the Holy Spirit you know but then it but so then so then it's like well so what do you do like like brother Madam talks about in the uh in the message um uh the one that starts with in Elijah the dish bite it was an inhabited yet be certain of God um from 1959 um listen to it a ton of times but anyway um like he talks about job and how job met the requirement and so some of it like what I've noticed with young people is there's a there's like people are so concerned about like looking at their lives and saying okay did I have a moment and am I changed instead of like have I done what the word of God asked and am I holding to that in faith like that's that's a completely different idea like and I think like that there's a there's a lot of young people that miss that you know and and I was explaining the to one brother at Camp it was like Hey That's not doing nothing like I'm not saying stop trying to do the right things and all of this what I am saying is as a that there is there's an action of Faith there's an active faith that has to be applied to say God I met the requirement I I was baptized and I repented and Lord if there's something I haven't repented of it you just show me and boom done like it's an attitude of repentance and so it's like and then okay I've met the requirement like I've been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and I've repented and God is obligated to fulfill his word but it's a like but the but the token is is a token that God has accepted your faith so it's like okay I've done these things but I still don't believe that you'll do it for me God so like when these people token that he's accepted your face your faith when you've done this thing add these things out of works and then said okay God do the thing like but you don't but but I'm too horrible like you probably shouldn't and you probably won't because I'm actually just too bad it's like no no no like no believe the word of God and so so to me I would say like if you're in that spot where you're like hey like man did I just have an experience oh you know or is did I actually have that change I would just say don't like just keep that attitude like if if if I haven't there's nothing more I can do unless God reveals to me there's something I haven't repented for because I've been baptized and I've repented and Lord you know like I'm just living in an attitude of repentance and so like and so if you if like so then I then I look like so then the what's the difference between the two it's like well one of them is I have it and I'm still living a life of repentance and saying God if there's anything I've done forgive me and show me and I'll change like yeah so like what's the like if you had that attitude God will fulfill his promise and will fulfill his word so the attitude before you have the the the the the change the experience the New Birth the baptism of the Holy Spirit like your attitude prior to that to receive it doesn't change after you do receive it so I would just say adopt that attitude meet God's requirement believe that he's going to fulfill his word because he's obligated to his word and then and then calm down because he's like he's going to do it that just just how it works and so so so you can you you know you can just take the pressure off like because you recognize this is something like you can't make it happen for yourself but God is going to fulfill his word when you believe him and when you do part of belief is doing what he says so it's not all of belief what are you supposed to do because I know I know because we're all human what are we supposed to do when we go to camp we get an experience we feel great we get home it's not the same and then we mess up and make mistakes and we just feel awful and say he does this well you made a mistakes so you didn't get a thing what are we supposed to do then believe in the grace of God yeah no I mean actually what do you mean by believing the grace of God indeed I mean like what I what I mean by that is like in your heart you're sitting there like the devil is trying to tell you like man I feel so terrible and it's just like yeah you're right I am terrible I'm awful and and then you start but like what are you doing you're believing the LIE of the devil but but the word says you're forgiven the word says you're redeemed the words as you're a child of God do you believe the word of God and what so so what that is is your heart saying God I don't care what my mind says I don't care what the the the the the the the effects of My Flesh are saying I am cleaving to what your word says and your word says I'm forgiven your word says that nothing neither height nor depth nor principality nor power or any other creature can ever separate me from the love of God I believe this God and so you don't have to sit there and live like in and and you grow in that and and you over you you overcome like it's there's there's some action there there's some Faith there there's some Faith muscle it doesn't just you just don't Waltz into it you know I I understand there's some generation you know that's some generational stuff like you know like an entitled age just feels like well I just like I'm gonna sit here I'm gonna ask God for it and then I'm just gonna have it and then I'm gonna be super Christian and if I don't if I'm not super Christian like after Camp then I didn't get anything and so we're gonna have to just wait for the next camp and see if it actually happens how do you know you got something oh like I said I think I think in in a week's time I think that's going to be really difficult in two weeks time I think that's going to be difficult in three months I think you should be able to see hey no there's like I've been changing in six months in a year you can look back and go okay there was something that actually happened and again like I'm not saying like 1997 when I received the Holy Spirit in in the year 2000 I was probably still going man in the year 2003 it's like Lord do I really have it do I really like and then so in those moments when you're sitting there going I am I'm such a you know a loser Lord I am just terrible I fail in my flesh all the time like how could I possibly have it what would I go back to I would go back to but Lord you know my heart I don't mean to do these things I Repent of these things Lord I've been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ father like I can't like I I'm doing I am giving you everything I have and I all I can do is just is just throw myself at your grace and mercy because I I'm not enough God and I'm never going to be enough and I you know and and here I am a message preacher at 44 and I still fail and I still make mistakes and that like the Holy Ghost isn't perfection like that's what the that's what the the the body we're gonna have in the Millennium that's a perfect body yeah that's a glorified body right so we're still going to struggle we're still going to fail so then I always come back to it's like well you come back to that attitude of faith and repentance God I've repented of these things I still struggle in my flesh but God I'm here I am living in an attitude and a heart of repentance and an attitude of faith that that you are redeemed you have redeemed me God that your your grace is sufficient for me like what does that even mean if like laughs like what do we mean by your grace is sufficient for me it's like well the Lord's Grace was sufficient to like save me take me to heaven and then like somehow because I had some experience at camp like I'm super Christian and I'm perfect that's not that's not what you know your grace is sufficient for me means Lord thank you for your grace you know so I I would say when you've gotten into a place where you're like like the the word of God like it's that seed that's growing and so I would just say like have you been growing and if you've been growing calm down keep believing like so like I could ask you and this was really helpful for me I know it'll be really help for everyone else remember that you're at Camp I woke up to you so you're gonna put a damage over and I asked you like I do these different things I'm sorry I preach I just don't feel like I'm dedicated enough and I didn't feel the way because I'm still making mistakes but what am I doing wrong here like I continue to make these mistakes but I am giving God what I have but I just don't feel dedicated enough because because so what I just knew um I I remember that so well because man it was so um it was just so it was so pivotal I think we learned so much hey everybody say hi to my appreciate from that yeah everybody say hi to my Tristan Eamon in the house hi Tristan um yeah that's my brother but anyway he's gonna get lots of follows now but um anyway so yeah you asked me like like I just don't feel dedicated enough and so I was just like okay what does dedicated enough mean like what is what okay so by what metric are you gonna determine like hey now I'm dedicated enough like that was like what's your vision of dedicated enough when do you when do you reach that Pinnacle of of Christianity and messageanity yeah like today or what yeah I don't think we were that like you know but it was like is it an hour of a tape a day is it 20 minutes of prayer or 20 minutes of Bible reading like is that dedicated enough like Define Dedicated enough and like basically what what you were asking is it's like like where when have I done enough works where um like now I've proven my experience and it's like just just man just think about that idea for a bit like that's not that's not what we're doing here like that's not that's not what this is about it's it's like the The Works will come yeah absolutely but there's and and is there overcoming to be done yeah there's overcoming to be done but but if in your heart like it's it's like hey but are we believing that God has done something in our heart and that's why I keep going back to spoken words The Original Seed like it just like even now just thinking about it just it just Thrills me it's like has has the word been born in your heart like have you been reborn like Jesus was born because Jesus was the firstborn among many Brethren his one bird his first birth is the same as what our new birth is and if you've had that new birth like that's the same like what happened to Jesus well he died in Rose again well what's going to happen to you when you have the same birth that Jesus had like well stop the Sun from rising man you're gonna you know you're gonna die you're gonna rise again like or you're gonna rise again in in the Rapture like it it just can't be any other way and so to to begin to recognize the word of God is is quickening in your heart like is to recognize that hey it's not about my am I dedicated enough and it and you you you get to you start recognizing that then no actually this really is about the love of God for us like it's not just something that we say but it it that's really the heart that it comes down to we we Market it in all these works and everything and and but it's but all of those things are because this is what God wants and what God loves and so when these people will stop religion say that you said something to that word it's like stop stop putting it into categories of things you can do it's like do I have a checklist like I told my wife I did I did this yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah so and I think that's you know that's just such a um I think that's a concept that that that that we've we've you know we've gone so far into like all of the stuff that you have to do that people don't recognize like hey what about Grace What about love these things are the foundation of what we believe and and Faith like to believe that God to believe that acts 2 38 is a promise for me that God is obligated to that um is uh is is just so like how you you have to believe that like you have to say like cling to that with everything that is in you and and and and and you know before your experience and after your experience what are you doing you're clinging to that you know I mean even brother Branham said I don't know like he was talking about his name being on the book and he said I don't know that my name's on the book but I but I believe it is you know and it's like so even he is just it is clinging in faith this is what this is about is fate you know if God wanted to be about Works will you just come down here and you know manifest himself to us and you know smack us on the hand with a ruler you know but but if he just wanted us to do that no he wants us to believe him he wants us to take his word and believe it and I think that's another thing this message is really about is it's like hey well do you do you believe it in spite of your failures do you do you believe the word of God yeah um and and that's what the experience I think is is bringing you to and there's but man I get it there's a lot of Flesh in the way you know and I went through all of that too you know and I still do um you know but yeah but it's like but but the grace of God is there for me and I have to believe in the grace of God like I can do nothing else other than just believe in the grace of God and the love of God and you know nothing in my arms I bring simply to thy cross I claim go ahead sorry no no go ahead so what you're saying is it's not a uh it's not a trick list it's not a after I do this this this now I can feel worthy it's a relationship we have to go back to a relationship with God not a order of like a martial law of you must do these things and then you're saved no it's it's a relationship you even told me that hey man I encourage you like throughout your day just talk to God and since then in my life I do that I just talk to them throughout the day and uh it's not about the uh the operational acts of faith it's because you have a relationship with that person like you have a wife or something if he's 100 100 it's a uh you're giving everything you can because you love them not because you're not not because you're trying to follow some rule or set of boundaries or whatever else it's like a uh yeah well what what was it in Paul's in Paul's words you know what what was the law for why why do we have the law the law was our point out our faults wow okay that too but but also ultimately like to to make Sin appear exceeding sin that's definitely a thing in Romans six yeah but I think it's Roman six but but the law was our school Master to bring us to Christ right so everything that you've experienced you know as a as a message believer like growing up in the message like and you feel like oh that's law like well but all of that was supposed to be bringing you to Christ so it's not to stay with it and it's not like that's gonna those things are gonna just like go away because then you recognize that these things are the things that are supposed to be connecting me to the heart of Christ and sometimes we do a really bad job at that but that is the point the law is a Schoolmaster to bring us to Christ and what that to what what is Christ Christ is the expression of the heart of God that's what brother Branham taught that's all that God was he poured into Christ he he was the he was the heart of the character and the Heart of God expressed and so the law is to all of these things that you've been brought up and you've been raised to do like all of those things are to bring you to Christ so the whole point is is like hey man I've been following these laws like this is kind of like I could rephrase your question like this right like hey yeah brother Trevor I've been I've been following these laws but I really like man I just want a law better like I wanna I wanna you know I want to law my laws man I wanna I wanna be so good at lying that you never saw anybody lie as good as I lied it's like well that's dumb like what's the point of the law well the law isn't the end the law is something that God uses to bring you to him so all of these things were there for your protection for their for to express who Christ is that God is a god of Holiness that God is a god of love that you know all of all of these things you know they they point us that that when we really think about them it's like we want all these things but the law is to bring us to Christ and so the whole point is hey can I get into the relationship and then the question becomes is like well not how can I be more dedicated but it's just like man I just I just want to know him better like I want man I just spend more time like it like like it like the stuff that you're doing is still the same but it changes the heart and and that's the thing that you should be looking for is have I had that time where my my heart has been changed or I want to do it because of my heart pulling me into that direction instead of my brain and the laws pushing me harder how should they uh here's the question how should a message can present the message to a kid their age that was raised denominational and it still ended in nomination there's difference but like how would you present that in the most effective way um um that's it that's a great question I think carefully um so I think one thing that you should recognize before like that I that I kind of realized experientially but I think if I could tell you this like it will help you um that like the the denomination is likely their safety net and what you're when you begin to present the message to them um what you begin to what what you're do what you're doing is this is you're saying hey because what they're doing they're trusting in a church they're trusting in their denomination what they may be trusting in Christ and great but okay most often they're going to be trusting in the church and when you begin to point out doctrines especially when you come to the point of Trinity that you feel that that you're like hey yeah you're Trinity Doctrine that's wrong what you're saying is is like the the thing that you staked your like whole eternity on because you chose this church is wrong and as soon as you do that like you better expect some pretty visceral reaction like you you need to realize what it is that's fake what you're doing is you're saying like that there's a safety net that you've been trusting in to keep you out of hell and it's wrong and you know and so it's like like that's a that's kind of a big deal you know so you just need to be be aware of that like that's what's at stake and so you can't like I think you know you can't you just don't want to go through there and beat them over the head with a with a message book you know and say ah your doctrine's wrong you know and just like I told you you wouldn't believe anyway boom like it's like no hey have a heart of what you're actually doing to this person because you're challenging like something down in their core this isn't just a mental mental gymnastics that we're all doing but this is like this is the thing they've staked their whole identity and everything else on and you're saying yeah no that's wrong and here's why so I think to present the message to denominational people like you need to at least understand like hey if they don't just love what you're saying like it's just like well this is the truth why wouldn't you love this like like yeah because look what you're look what you're saying like your whole everything you've done in the past is wrong so here you go and this is why like I would just say like have a heart like recognize like that's not gonna come easy all the time like we believe that the spirit can go and work in their heart and like and and Quicken that but that doesn't you know that that it doesn't it doesn't always just happen just like that you know it's not always just Supernatural every time talk to somebody and if it's not Supernatural like well apparently they just don't get it you know I mean it's just you know it just doesn't it just doesn't always happen that way you know so so I would say just recognize that like they're clinging to this because this is salvation to them and when you begin to break down their means of Salvation like that can really go south in a hurry and so just something to think about as you as you present and and and and so that you can present it rightly like I read a quote in um in Norway where brother Branham talked about it if this mess this message should be the flame of the hour but it also should be the flame of our hearts so that we can present it and if we wasn't the flame flame our heart hey man your hair looks okay it's all good yeah no so if this message isn't the flame of our hearts you know then we we don't present it rightly to the people so I think like but but all that to say like there's a way to present it rightly and I think some a lot of that just is is in our heart too is a heart that says man I love you I care for you I want to show you this like and not just like oh hey stupid denominational person you don't have the doctrine right allow me to come and yeah you correctly like good luck that'll sound how do you like approach it let's say if they're underaged and you know they're their parents still so it's really a tough thing yeah I think I think you know I think this is where you need you know you need to have a rapport with these people with with this person like this isn't you know like I I think it'd be a bit interesting to go to some kid on the street and say hey Hey kid you know I gotta I got some Doctrine for you I mean it's just like like just not sure that that's that's the style housing but you know obviously be led by the spirit of God you know if you have a heart like something's just constraining you for someone you know yeah you would wanna you wanna reach out to them you want to try to share the Faith with them you want to try to share this Revelation with them and I think that's great um and and so we should and we should have a heart to do that um and so I think but I think you know you need to have a rapport it's just like you know brother Branham even gives us plenty of illustrations in the message you know he's talking about being a car dealership and he starts yeah oh these are great cars like oh and so they start talking about cars and then maybe he drops in a line you know about like oh the Lord's certainly good to you in your business or something like that and if and if there's a response based on like oh yeah certainly he is he's so good like then he can continue to develop the conversation into things of the Lord but if if they didn't respond at all then there was no you know there was no uh that he he just kind of like he would let it go and that's what he tells us you know he would do so there's there's some there's some there's some ways of working a rapport to to have a conversation with somebody to get on the things Lord and to start you know maybe testing the waters and talking to people you know instead of just uh you know having our you know our our shotgun fully loaded with message document to blast them with you know that just doesn't that doesn't work so how you know how are you gonna just like obviously you want to be friendly you want to you know like how is that going to work with whoever it is well who knows you know I mean I don't know no I like I was talking to a magician or actually a juggler one time because I like juggling you know and so I went to see this guy and I was the only one that showed up for his show and uh it was just at a little local County Fair so it wasn't a huge thing you know so we just and we so we just started talking and then some and then no we don't need to hear about it or David I don't know whose beard growth we need to hear about but no it won't grow right here well I'm great here very much it Rose was right here okay we have now heard about that okay moving on so you know so but when I just you know we were talking about you know I asked him to show me a couple of things you know and and I don't know how we got onto the top of talk about topic of godhead but we did and it's not because I tried to force it but it's just it naturally flowed and and you know and that's that's what what you're trying to do and so then if you have that opportunity you know and you feel the the leading of the spirit like you should be looking for those opportunities absolutely and then I would say like doctrinally then I you know what I I would do is just I'm I mean unless there's some glaring thing or they're asking questions I mean like a lot of sisters are just going to get asked the questions this is like hey look you know why are you dressed this way okay because you're a great Christian yeah because uh I'm not a Christian no I'm a Christian and I don't dress this way you know and so you've you've offended them just by saying well I dress this way because I'm a Christian and they're a Christian and they're not interesting that way you know so it's like so you you you should know the answers you should know what the word says you know you should know that it's Deuteronomy 22 you should know First Corinthians yeah First Corinthians 15 I think it is you know about you know about the hairs are covering and you know not trimming hair and things like that and then just say like so what I what I usually do um in presenting it to co-workers and different things that they start asking me questions it's like hey well I just you know like you know I'm not crazy here like I believe that because of this scripture now you may disagree with like how we might interpret that or how we look at that that's fine I understand that but understand the reason I'm doing this X Y or Z or the reason that is because of this scripture right here so I'm First Corinthians 11 15 is what my wife is telling me so but anyway um and so so it's like I'm always bringing it back to scripture and showing like hey scripture and then they're like okay well well why do you interpret you know you know pants as as men's garments it's like well first we need to we need to both agree that because the scripture says that a woman shouldn't put on a garment that pertains to a man that there is such a garment like it that language necessitates there must be a garment that pertains to a man and that a woman shouldn't wear so all we got to do now is figure out what is that thing what is that garment okay how do we figure that out well hey just so happens I believe how we know this is because God sent a prophet like he said he would do in the scripture Malachi 4 5 and 6. and and again because the Bible says there is a prophet that in Elijah that's supposed to come and do these things I I'm expecting it why not because we're just some weird religion because the Bible says this and so all of the doctrine from the message that you know like it it all comes back down to the scriptures but then Branham was very much in the scriptures we we don't we don't have doctrine that we that that we can't substantiate completely in the scriptures so like to know some of those scriptures so that you can so that you can say hey well because of this this is the scripture that that that shows us these you know this thing or that thing or whatever and so I can show you like hey it's in the word of God and and I find this to be you know I find this to be amazing in my life I thought the you know the the Revelation that that I have because I follow this Prophet now is like I understand all these things in Revelation I'd love to talk to you about it sometime but you know like and you're not like you're not pushing Doctrine but you're opening a door to show hey there's there's a lot of understanding like if you think that the revelations is that John ate pizza and then had a dream like I'd just like to show you that there's so much more richness in the word of God like and if you're interested I'd love to show that to you but I'm not you know I'm not I'm not gonna and and you know what but let's let's pray for one another you know and so so you don't have to you don't have to be militant about it you don't have like you you throw out some seeds you know you throw out some water yeah you throw out some kindness you throw you you let your life live and you and you let them see that the expression of all of these things that you're talking about it comes back down to your life and if your life is is is you know full of grace and full of love and you know that it becomes uh that that becomes very attractive you know and I think that's one of the that's one of the struggles that we have too is that that because we all think that this message is just a bunch of laws we're like yeah nobody wants this message like what why would they want to be part of all these laws it's like oh no man like no like that's not like it's so we've that that's that that's that's an indicator like well we're kind of missing the heart of God here because yeah to be honest this is the most enriching way to live the best way to live I mean you know otherwise you could say well culture is doing a really great job actually and I just think actually people want to live more like the direction that culture is going right now you know all of these lgbtq trans blah blah blah like yeah and that's that's you know you the cultures like no no like really you know uh you know being an American married been married for 20 almost 23 years maybe 23 years and all wait no it is August 23 where 23 years in like nine days I don't know what day it is today it's August 12th I know that okay so I just don't know what today is so um you know that's that's an amazing thing and and it's a rewarding way to live and you know the the message is one of like these last places on Earth that actually you know that that actually says you know hey you should get married and stay married you know um I'm not saying the message says you have to get married you know you understand what I'm saying but who doesn't want to get married though I guess some people might but and that's fine what are signs some guys want to be that way that's fine you know and some some sisters and all of that so I'm not downplaying that but but it is to say that you know like this is the best way to live and if if we don't understand the heart of God if we if we haven't if if we haven't seen that the word actually is um is prescribing for us that this is an amazing way to live then we're really missing a lot of of of what makes this so wonderful so what um what do you mean by uh the way to live compared to let's say another group let's say a Pentecostal group that has Holiness and they believe in the you know like uh some similar things Holiness uh baptism in Jesus name but what do you mean way to live because the similar you know we don't believe you know serpency prophets or godhead or something like that but other things that was pretty similar um um sure and I would say to that like so the degree that they're like they are living in the same in the same way that we are because of the word of God the the Those portions of the word of God that they see and they they understand and they live their life like it does enrich their lives and it does make their lives better like they believe in marriage and they believe in Holiness and all of those things that that are that are amazing truly heartfelt Ways to Live um but I would say then that now we get into more like way more Nuance um of like of like Doctrine because like if you believe in in the Trinity then you have then you have a God uh a father that's actually uh waiting to send you to Hell except for the fact that uh the sun came along and decided to love you and to save you instead and then you have a holy spirit that comes and does stuff in your life and that's kind of like a a pretty good representation of the truth like you like that you have to think about it like that right yeah and so so what that does is like it really it begins to really mess with your emotions like I um actually just in February like the soccer program I was talking about um one of the other uh board members is a is a former UPC Pastor um he's uh he's still a kind of fossil pastor but he's not part of UPC anymore he's independent now but as he was he grew up in you know Pentecostal Holiness UPC and to talk to him you know he's like yeah because we you know because we believed what did he say because we were Oneness he said man we had to hit the altar every single every single service man and it's like well you think about that like if you if you do believe speaking in tongues is the evidence and then they don't believe in eternal security they don't believe in in what that they they would use the term once saved always saved in a negative way so they don't believe that like when the word is born in your heart like we talked about earlier that that's like that settles it like Jesus was born we are reborn like it's this that's that's that's the same birth and they don't believe that they believe you have to come to the altar you have to repent you have to speak in tongues you have to receive the Holy Ghost and you walk out the doors and you hope you hope that you just don't mess up for a while so that you can keep the Holy Spirit around because as soon as you mess up you've lost the Holy Spirit and you've got to come back and get the Holy Spirit at the altar again and speak in tongues again or at your prayer closet or wherever so it's a constant like that's what I'm saying like this is not not like that Doctrine like keeps you like in this complete state of fear and this complete State there's no Assurance you know how do they how does the UPC or or any denominational Christian actually saying Blessed assurance Jesus is mine like like if they believe in the Trinity they can't what is go ahead because they they because of the way they believe in the godhead it it necessitates that they don't like they could say well I've been born again it's like well what does that mean well I believe that Jesus you know he died for me and so like they don't actually like Baptist you know they don't actually believe that they change there's no Holy Spirit to come inside you and actually change you and Quicken the word of God in your heart and and mold you and make you it's like no it's all just a bunch of works and it's all just like I have to sit I just believe in the grace of God and because I believe in that you know he's not changing me but I believe it's Grace so he's going to take me to heaven so like yeah like like that's not a fulfilled way to live like no I actually want to change I actually want to overcome like I know I have to you know spend some time in my life actually overcoming but I also know that the holy spirit is going to help me and guide me and Quicken these things to me and change change me and and mold me and make me in His image and like that's so powerful and wonderful thought because it really because it because it reminds me that I'm not alone in this and that God can do this and so that's like the heart like that's where this message so shines to me because it's like no no other not even UPC which is about as close to the messages you can get feels that way like to have that connection like that assurance and that peace that God has promised that he's going to do this in my life if I'm yielding him and walking with him like that's that that's an amazing thing but how could like which God are you walking with if you have a trinity like you know like that that so so those understandings really really change how you feel and how your response is to the word of God and how you live your life that's right does that does that make sense do you understand what I'm saying by that yeah yeah it makes total sense I mean like the uh the there is a difference between between just saying oh well hey they call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved and he does that but you know there's this whole prescription over here and where does that fit I mean we have Peter over here we can say Peter yeah it's wrong you say repay you know but it's like there's all there's a difference between just saying oh I prayed a two-minute prayer now I'm saved and actually going through the actual prescription but how do you present that we're going to say oh well it just says you know either by the name of Lord will be saved yeah well so what I've done in the past is like what does it mean to believe on Jesus Christ so then you go to John 1 1 in the beginning was the word and the Word was God you know and the Word was made flesh and dwelt Among Us so if you tell me you're believing on Jesus like it's more than that you believe the ACT of him dying on Calvary that's that's believing Jesus died on Calvary like but what does it mean to believe on Jesus Christ and and I I think it's a bit hard to say to where the word says Jesus is the word and then you believe this one part of it but then you throw all of the rest of this away I I struggle to understand how it is that you believe on Jesus Christ that's how I would present that now I'm not saying that you're not saved but but why would you take this and leave all of the rest of this out well because it's not convenient it gets it's in the way of my life and blah blah blah so okay you believe that Jesus saved you but you worship the god of your own mind I see what part of it yeah that what part of that just doesn't actually work like the uh well then the you know like what about the oh you're just you're frustrating the grace of God when you say all that that's cute yeah like you know like like look let's let's you know that's just not even being honest you know I mean that's just like I just like I just wanna I wanna believe some Christian needs to to placate my my feelings and go live my life man like like what are you gonna what are you gonna do I mean if if they're not convinced that Jesus is the word and the word is the best thing that could have ever came to this earth because because it is God like you know I can't you know you're not gonna change their hearts and no amount of like arguing in the beginning and all of that you know you you we we we we spread the seed man we talk about the word we we throw the word out there we we talk about how wonderful the word is and amazing it is and here's what it says and here's how that guides my life and I think that's a wonderful thing and and and then we live change lives before the people and that's attractive and if it's not attractive like I can't you know I can't I can't buy sheer force of my will we're saved by the will of God and not by the will of man yeah so I can't buy sheer force of my own will present the gospel to someone in such a way that I've smacked them with it so good that they just have nothing left to do but just okay like I mean maybe like I'm not saying that's never happened but it's like it just depends on where their heart is you know we could have a heart that's right and be really resistant to things you know like in your mind and you may have to unravel a lot of knots for somebody but if there's something there if there's a seed and there's something in their heart that's calling out for more like they'll they'll they'll keep coming back to get smacked by the things that you're saying you know but but if there's not like like I I don't I don't know what else to do other than to to try to live an attractive God Godly life in front of them yeah I mean like what what about the uh baptism like that seems to be like the point where like oh you don't have to be baptized you know like what uh role does that really play in it according to like deal I was just calling the Lord and shall be saved how do you address that yeah it's just pray a little prayer and believe and you're done yeah well I just again I would just say look I think there's just more to the word of God um I'm not frustrating I'm not saying that you know that you're not saved again like like with the heart of like hey recognize that this is the one thing they're like they're holding on to and if you trash that for them you're like you know they're basically lost so you you have to you know it's just like man I'm so glad like start with like look I am so glad that you believe on Jesus Christ that is so amazing it just man I'm just so thrilled that you're my brother that you're my sister that that we serve the same Lord Jesus and he's alive and he's risen and it is so good this is so good I'm just curious though it acts 19 you know these people are baptized by John and yet Paul is telling them to get re-baptized so I'm just I'm just curious what you think about that like why does the word talk about that you know and so you then you begin to have a conversation with the person and not with their denomination and I think that's a huge that's a point too that's a that's a really big thing is like it you know um Zion Zion ended up having a bunch of conversations with this Mormon guy and that was my advice to Zion the whole time I was like try to get him to talk to you like a person like a living being that has his own thoughts and not as an embassy of the Mormon church because if you can get him to there then now you have now you can have a real conversation I said what you but what you don't want to do is you don't want to be the next you know just another conversation of message versus Mormon because message versus Mormon removes it from person right it moves or message versus Pentecost or message versus Baptist or whatever like if you begin to interact with people as like well your church says this and they're wrong it's like you know like maybe maybe not the most active thing talk to the person not the church through the person and then yeah so then so have like have relationships relational conversations with people and I think you you you go a lot farther and they begin to see a lot more and even if you know if they you know if God opens their eyes great maybe you know I don't I don't know you know but I but I but I certainly know that if I'm talking to their Church through them that I'm trying to win their church and I'm not trying to win them so make it a make it a personal thing and and so that's why I would say like hey compliment them on because that's what the prophet told us to do it's like you know you want to sell a guy a Pneumatic Hammer you know a nail gun you know and he's a carpenter like don't tell him his you know swinging you know man the day's a swinging Hammer you're just so backwards you shouldn't even you don't have a thought coming unless you use one of these nail guns you know the guys you know you just insulted him you're not gonna make a sale here and that's that's the that's what brother Branham is telling us it's like hey if you want to win somebody tell them what a great job they're doing but tell them then how much better they might do if they had this nail gun so start presenting more like tell them like hey man you believe Jesus Christ that praise God that's so amazing aren't you just so amazed by the love of God you know and then and then okay now we've complimented them as a carpenter and now okay here you go here's the here's the here's the air powered gun here's here's more that you can do and how much stronger of a Christian do you think you might be if you were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and you you took on his name like you you're living his like you you become Mrs Jesus Christ like you you're symbolizing that I've died out to my own self and I'm Ro right I've risen a new in a new life with Jesus Christ and that he's coming back for me and that my whole identity is now wrapped up in who he is like you know like that's that's I think way more powerful than um um you know than okay your church is wrong because you baptize wrong because you do this and you do this and the word says this here it's like yeah yeah yeah you're right I'm not gonna win me not I mean maybe you'd win somebody but it's not gonna be like not me like I don't know it's really good what uh and then that covers them it can be a very hard thing to figure out and I think that definitely makes it better um here's a good here's a question like what would be the difference you think we went to train a day I will be the difference from like Oneness and what we believe um so I actually need to understand one that's better like because like I still like because like United Pentecost they believe in Oneness right but they still believe in the Holy Spirit and I don't quite get that but I believe you know like like so um I I what I can tell you though is from what I know of talking you know the the people the Oneness people that I've talked to like they are that is that is what I was referring to it's like they they typically believe that you have to speak in tongues to receive the Holy Spirit and as soon as you sin you've lost it because they don't believe in the indwelling of Christ in your life because it's all just in Christ like Christ is is everything and and there's no you know that that it's it's it's every everything that is God is exclusively in Jesus Christ now and I don't quite understand how the Holy Spirit works for Oneness people but he can but he can't like actually live in you he can just help you do stuff you know is is kind of like the like and I'm you know I'm sure I've just offended any United Pentecost that I've ever lived by by saying it that way but like yeah effectively from everything I can understand from any United Pentecostal I've talked to and I've talked to a few like that's the uh that's the whole idea so one this me like Oneness would also not believe in eternal security like like we do and that's just so huge you know and because because they don't believe in the abide you know the indwelling of the holy spirit in your life that changes you so I don't believe that the word of God is a seed that that the new birth you know like like changes you into a child of God like we do um and I think that's just um you know so you just live in fear and you just live in like I've gotta you know it works it just becomes works you know and I just can't stress enough how much this message is not just works it's just it's not I had a friend no I'm not trying to change your actions and look to change who you are because you know I think uh Richard Dawkins or Sam Harris could come into a lot of people out of believing in God but that's just convincing no it's in the Insight it's who you are not what rules you're following yeah so like one thing I've thought of because I was always wondering you know specifically on the godhead side you know of course the Trinity is wrong but what was wrong with the Oneness and when one time I was driving and I thought of it I think God showed me it's the Eternal sonship that I read the same whisper a long time wondering like oh wait the one if you're wrong because they say it's an eternal son but you know the rest of Jesus was created yeah it died because that difference that's yes that's that's definitely a thing and I think then um you have to It Might Get Loud here because people just got home um I think then you know for me then I I wanna I wanna connect that into like what is what's the heart of God in that like what is that what does that mean and I think when that comes down to is that is is what that what that means for me is kind of everything that I've I've stated there is like hello David Zion says hello David's followers um I you know that it that what that means man I want I don't want like like light just totally in a bat around here let me close this curtain here a little bit so you don't all see my my closet but I think you know I I want to find like what is that how do I connect that to my heart like okay there's there's no Eternal sonship and and it's like well so I think that all comes back down to the new birth and how how real that is because Christ was born if it's an eternal sonship now it's just I mean he's basically the same as Melchizedek and and so you know he just kind of popped onto the world for a while and then gone and then because there's no birth of Christ essentially then there would be no new birth for us and so I think that's that's the concept of that that I think to me is those are the things that I always look for it's like where does this Doctrine connect meaning about the heart of God into to my heart and that and those are the things that I want to understand because all of these things do Express those things and so um so yeah I mean those things are like you know like now we're in like message 401 you know like kind of kind of area you know as far as you start getting into godhead and how then to apply but I would say that there's like that's the thing I think the Lord has been showing me over the last couple of years is like like applying godhead applying serpent seed like there's so many things that like my walk with Christ has been so much enriched in the last couple of years by diving into those things and understanding like the the meaning of those things in from a heart perspective I love that because it changes the uh it's changed I've changed my perspective some problem like these aren't just doctrines we believe that are different semantics than what some people other people believe it's entirely different it's not just the godheads it's the new birth it's the serpent seed it's the message it's the prophets it's everything yeah yeah I mean to think about serpent seed it's like well that means that there's a true seed and if you're true seed like yeah it's like yeah I had the same seed that Adam a Son of God was like he's taking a Rapture man like there's a confidence there's an assurance that comes with these things and so I think the the and and then and if he threw these things out and you didn't have these understandings it's like well then why do some people have it and some people don't and God is just kind of like random and is choosing now and there's no real reason for it it's like no actually there's there's there's legitimate reasons and there's stuff you know and and to me like it brings my confidence in God and who God is and it enriches it so yeah it's not like oh yeah understand this Doctrine more correctly than the Pentecostals understand this Doctrine more correctly than the Baptist good job message person you're great like my friends that like activated me into just being passionate and this whole preaching everything else they believed it wrong but as I got older I realized it had very little to do with the semantics of whether Jesus is a son or whatever it had to do with it was interlinked with the new birth because they're both non-divorce and they and they she's not missed at all so we had very little almost to do with the semantics and it was what it actually represented in their hearts I haven't looked at like that so thank you that's just yeah I mean to me that just that's what I as every Doctrine I want like I don't want to just like yes I can understand it correct and I can you know I love to study different things I love to study deep deep things um you know usually when I do I end up coming out and just being like it just amazes me about God you know so much more you know um you know I just there's there's moments that I I'll just always remember you know I was studying on a sermon for the the Feast of the trumpets and I was listening to the piece of the trumpets tape you know a few years back and and when I finally like when God felt like like got through my stupid brain like what brother Brandon was actually trying to say in that like like it just like my whole world exploded and I was just like oh Lord that's the coolest thing ever you know and I started understanding you know the two days of atonement and things like that I won't go into it like but but it just just to say that like those times when I dove into Doctrine and really be comprehended the meaning underneath it those are the times when like my walk with Christ is just like you know it's like you just you just dove into a big pool of God's love and you're like oh Lord you're so cool and amazing and I'm just so thankful I'm your child thanks great yeah that's just you know so if you were asked let's do this if you're asked what is the message by somebody how would you answer um hey hi job how are you mate um no that was Australian sorry anyway he's laughing and hating me now but um but um what is the message um you know for for me like it's a bit hard to say like what do you mean by the message Okay so you know I think for me it's it's um yes I know you're not Australian and I'm just my producer my British accent just failed me in the moment so yeah um uh my British accent wasn't too good in it no I used that wrong too anyway what is the message um like for me like the first thing that comes to mind is is um is come out upon my people is is a calling out of denomination like I I don't like I think that is like so the purpose of it is is so that we can see that it's a relationship with Christ like I think you know and then you look at the last paragraph of the church age book you know brother Branham says not for one moment do I bring a message that man may follow me or join my church or something like that but if but if I can see one thing and that's to have the you know people have a true a spiritual relationship with Jesus Christ like like that to me that's like that's like his heart statement like that's what he's saying like this is what I'm about is I want to connect people with Jesus Christ in a true spiritual relationship because what has happened it like it it the message is saying come on for my people but it's not just saying come out for my people it's like what do you mean by come out of her my people the message is also saying this and that's what this to me that's what the seals are is is it like especially the first four is it's the exposing of the Trent and the church ages do this quite a bit those two things together you know is exposed foreign is to have entered into the devil system so this is why you need and and showing how that happened and all the deception and all of the breakdown of Doctrine and life and fellowship and all of these things like the message says you've got to come out of her and oh by the way this is what her is and why and how it became her and I use her very specifically as you know as the denominational church as the Catholic system as you know Jezebel the great the the great Harlot and the daughters that became daughter churches that are you know like and and so it exposes it exposes the True Vine and the false Vine and says here you go come into the True Vine stay out of that false mind and so that to me is is like is what this message is doing and I mean that you know there's probably a hundred other things but to me that's that's what it's saying like that's you know like so we started with vindication it's like well you've got to vindicate a profit to come and say all of these things and to show us what all of those things are and so so you know a lot of the message is just like showing us who's the one that's gonna who's who's the one that's the Fulfillment of Malachi four five and six and Revelations 10 7 and Revelation 3 14 and all these other scriptures you know like like he has to show us like John had to identify for the Pharisees who I you know he's like I am the voice of one crying in the wilderness so so so John came and identified in the scripture who he was before the people and so I think brother Branham had part of the message is brother Brian I'm identifying this is what people just like don't like but brother Branham had to come and identify himself in the scriptures just like John had to identify himself in the scriptures and that seems arrogant but it's like only a prophet can tell you that so like it just kind of necessitates that Moses had to come with two signs and so that's why we have Vindication is because the indication is like yeah it sounds like this guy is being arrogant but actually I told him to say that and here here's how you know like here's signs and wonders to show you that I'm backing up this man and what he's saying and so it's like okay great we now know who it is that we're supposed to listen to Okay now what's he saying and what he's saying is come out for my people come out of a church relationship come out of a system come out of religiousness and come into a true relationship with Jesus Christ and oh by the way you couldn't do that because you didn't know who it was because the devil's system like broke down all of these truths for you and and deceived all of this stuff so but actually here's the doctrines that show what Jesus who Jesus Christ is and and and so now you can know him he's not three he's not one you know he's he's he's he's he's God the Eternal spirit that that then had a body that he came and dwelt inside so like so now you can know him and now you can love him now he can take on his name you know because he came in his father's name and even identify with him just like a bride would identify with her husband and like all of these things like but the heart of it is has come out of church and religiousness identify who gets to say what what those things is are expose those things and say Here's the truth and now that you have the truth you can know him walk with him and love him and that to me is what this message is wow I think I'm happy with that how would you uh take that let's say you gotta Report with some people they're denominational they ask you what is this message that I've known for years but you never really identified it and yes it's that's a great explanation on it how would you word it in a short like a short way exactly to that um messageteacher.com you too can study the church age book um uh maybe a different kind of book than you were thinking but yeah um yeah so yeah like people know that you dress a certain way that you believe differently they maybe even heard sermons but they don't know what is this message yeah so I think I think everything like so what you're asking is like how would I take what I just said and break that down into maybe um like to someone who wouldn't understand nomination yeah denominational person so that they wouldn't understand like everything I just like said at that surface other than like wow that was passionate didn't sound school but I have no idea what any of that meant yes yeah I think I just have to go slower it's like hey look there's a lot to unpack for you you know I I I just asked you know you give me an opportunity to to spend a couple hours with you to really talk about like if you're interested if you're truly interested and we want to have this conversation we can have a relational and I'm not going to attack like I'm going to say things but I'm not attacking you I just I just want to show you what got to show me and and and and where in the scripture these things are and you know um and I would I so I would just say like I couldn't do it in five minutes always you know other than to say like look hey I just want you to know like this is an amazing life and I can show you a few different things where I feel like maybe you're you know your denomination isn't serving you great but I'm just so thankful you love Jesus you know so give me an opportunity to take a couple hours to show you some of these things and then I can show them then we can sit down and go hey look I want you to see why I believe there's a profit and here's Malachi it's like here's Revelation 10 7. and by the way why do we need Revelations 10 7. well well like what is the Mysteries that we were missing and then I can kind of walk them through some of those Mysteries and I could go I mean there's a there's a hundred ways that I could do it and I would and I know that some of that is because I'm a minister and I've studied these things and I'm 44 and I just wouldn't expect you know you know a a 20 year old message young person like to just know all of these things you know that's that's but I think you but but you can grow into and and know and the message is so vast and and um and amazing so I think um I think what I would just start with and this is this is what I've started with is like unless like unless they're Catholic so like if they're any other denomination other than Catholic I would point out to them like here's my like I I just want you like here's my opening cell though like right my my my shot across the bow like here's this is this is how this is gonna go you you know and I've done this with with with uh you know other denominational people it's like who just because usually other denomination people are gonna Protestants are gonna disagree with the Catholics okay like that's the whole point right ever since Luther there's a division there like this is Protestants means they protest the Catholic Church okay so they don't agree with the Catholic church but they baptize exactly like the Catholic Church so that's going to be my like if I if I really want to kind of start something and just see like hey can we take this conversation into some interesting places where I can show you why I believe these things like I'm gonna start with you baptized the exact same way the Catholic Church it does and here in Revelations it talks about this and it shows that she's Rome and I could show you this and I could prove this to you it's a city that sits on Seven Hills like just everybody knows this is Rome so this is the mother Harlot and she had daughters and they all baptized the same way and you're trusting in your denomination I want you to trust in Jesus Christ and there's just so much more of the word I can open up to you if you're interested in that conversation and so I think that's kind of the way you've got to do it because you can't you know you can't just expect that that is going to happen in a two minute conversation so it's like here's my opening here's how I'm going to start this conversation I'm going to start with what well one of the things is is I disagree with the nomination and then I'm and then and also in that conversation I'm going to bring in kind of why I believe in a prophet because because it took a profit to explain this is why when I read these things I understand them this way it's because God sent us a prophet you know so those two things are going to be kind of my like how I might start that conversation okay interesting So like um let's say you're younger than they are and just by position of them being older and you know they're just by default they're not going to want to have some kid at their age you know lecture among the message for two hours to just some sometimes that's just not going to date what would you recommend like you know let's say listen to these tapes you know or look at this thing online or whatever I mean you know that's it's just like wow like I would never tell them to look up anything online with the message I would tell them like look if you looked us up online there's so much negative out there right now I can yeah everything else yeah I can point you to a couple of reputable sites that actually talk about this with some truth but you know there's a lot of there's a lot of people that have been hurt by other people and now they're blaming all of this so you know just know that if you're gonna look at this up online you're gonna there's a lot of trash that you're gonna go through I would like to present this to you the real thing to you but um but hey okay you want to listen to a tape I guess it's gonna depend on how the conversation started like if you're younger than that person like you're probably not in the middle of like some like the doctrinal conversation and you know it's like like we have to we have to also understand like you know you you David are super interested in Doctrine and have been for many many years and maybe not everybody else maybe not everybody else is there so like trying to think of this one you know not just David as a young person but you know just just any young person out there like they're younger and they and and they want to present something they want to say hey maybe you should listen to you know I'd like to send give you this tape or something like that it just kind of like I think I would choose different tapes um like I love be certain of God like one of the things I want to you know I would just want to do is just like hey this is just so this is what's moving to me like I I just love this you know and I love what he said about this and that and you know I love what he said about meeting just meeting the requirement and trusting God and you know and there's gonna be like there's gonna be some heavy Doctrine and almost just almost every tape like you just can't really Escape it yeah um so I might Point them to be certain of God I might just say Hey listen to life story like because I I want you to hear about this this man that I'm I'm following his teachings listen to this God there's more than one there's three well he preached one uh what's the 59 ones uh 39 or 125 in Jeffersonville both 412 in Los Angeles and 0708 in Cleveland Tennessee which everyone starts with and Elijah the Tish bite who wasn't in the habit of Gilead Jacksonville yeah yeah he starts reading the uh First Kings 17. you got that yes like and it reads like this Elijah perfect okay yeah because yeah like my point is like there's some situation to ancestors like you know like they asked let's say they asked like a 17 year old kid something younger who doesn't know all these things but they know this message is right and say like don't look it up a line but just listen to this song and this sort of like life stories but but again like I like like that's what I would do because I connect with be certain of God like like I I lost my job and my wife was pregnant like all within like two weeks like you know what like at 21 years old you know and I adjusted and it was just like dude I'm listening on repeat man because that's just what I needed you know like I needed to be certain that God was there you know and so yeah so I would say like just as I've been saying like don't like let's not let's not turn this into the message witnessing you know training institute but like what tape sticks out to you what what you know then then then hey man like because that's something that you're passionate about being about talking about and you know you can't so like so I would I would I would recommend tapes that I knew well enough to where I could have a conversation about and if I didn't know any tapes well enough that I could have a conversation about that with somebody else that's kind of a problem like the uh saying like in general like life story what about like uh you know how the angel came to me in his commission yeah I think that's I think that's good you know I think you know if you started with life story that's you know like I wouldn't inundate them with like five tapes to listen to or anything like that and you might start with life story or like I said start with any teachers might be perfect well you know but that's not where they're at in their life you know like yeah like the the intricacies of you know divorce and remarriage and all of that like maybe that's not the place to start you know I mean I know some people that just slapped them upside the head with serpents even it's like well I really don't like it or not you know it's like well I mean okay that's one Theory you know and that's worked you know but I think you know be led by the spirit and then but I would say generally what I've done and I I can only just speak to what I've done is I've I've recommended tapes that that were meaningful or moving to me I think I did lean not to thy known understanding one time um because I knew like like where the person I was talking to was at in their life and so I think a lot of it is just going to depend on um you know who you're talking to where they're at all of that yeah you know and and so some of that's gonna like some of that's just gonna be like hey get more familiar with the message and you'll you'll have a represent of things to to to use and to refer to be based on situations that you're in so that you can just be very personal and very you know very real about that yeah well I'm right at where you want to end so I have one last question the more rapidly yeah okay so you know for Miss kids you know standing and knowing all these things this can be like a daunting task there's over 1200 tapes so for someone that's like hey this is already good how do I get better understanding all this what should they look up and listen to um so uh that's a great question uh this is bothering me so I'm gonna do that um yeah that's that happier now um there's a there's a three uh there's a three-part Series in Jeffersonville I think in like 1959 um uh that where brother Brenham says here's all the like he goes through he it's basically a three-part series at the at the brand of Tabernacle and one of them is the serpent seed and so you find that one in the message in Jeffersonville yeah if you want to do that for me um and then there's like um the baptism of the Holy Ghost and why we are not not a denomination I think it's those three are a weekend of meetings that brother Branham um okay so yeah like so the evening in the morning the morning was Bachelor of the Holy Ghost evening was the serpent seed yeah and then what is it is it the next Sunday is is uh uh why we're another nomination I thought it was like a Saturday night Sunday morning Sunday night but I could be wrong on that see what's the date like before and after those those two uh 5809 27 is why are we not doing elimination okay so those three that's another ghost serpent seed why are we not a denomination I would start with those three because brother Brandon begins to like he lists all of the the kind of the doctrines of of the Branham Tabernacle is what he says you know and he he lists all of them you know baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and the godhead and eternal security and um yeah sorry it just can't rattled from the top of my head always but you know like I would start maybe with those those tapes right there um I would say like if you're older um you know if you're if you're over 15 16 years old I a church age book and I know that that's a daunting task um there is a nice study guide out there on message teacher.com yeah I love the self-promotion I get to do um but seriously like I you know I could care less if you if you used my study guide like what I can say about the reading the church age book and that yes it's 300 and some pages and that some people don't like reading or whatever man read two pages a day read five pages a week I don't listen to it listen to it yeah there's a there's a great audio of it you know and do it in small chunks you know do it in 15 minute chunks or something like that so it's not it's not daunting to you um but I what I can say is you know I had a brother that list that told me he's like man you just gotta read the church age book and I was like you know okay I'll read the church age book and I read the church age book and I found myself going oh that's why I believe that like that makes sense to me now and I you know you know I loved that feeling of like hey this makes sense and I I understand this now and and it armed me so much better and and like it just quickened a lot of things to me um so you know there's so much scripture that brother Brandon's going through and he's bringing out all these Concepts so I would say those three tapes and I would say you know read the church H book make a commitment to read the church age book just like you're going to read your Bible make a commitment to read your Bible all the way through if you've never done your Bible cover to cover and you've just kind of spot checked and you know I've read this and then I felt led to read this and then I felt red to read a short Psalm and then I felt red LED to read another short Psalm and then you know and that's been like your Bible reading like make a commitment I'm going to read my Bible all the way through and grab a Bible in the year plan and even if it takes you three years I mean I'm in the middle of my last go through on the Bible in a year plan and I realized that I'm in August and I started it last year and it's August so I'm not making it through in one year and I'm obviously not going to make it through in two years but fine I'm still just you know I'm just methodically going through it now if I feel felt led to hit something else I'm gonna do that but like but then I come back to it and I go back okay here's where I get left off I scratch it off when I'm done you know and so I would say make a commitment to read your Bible make a commitment to read the church age book at some point and those three tapes like like like just start you know start with something you know like just make a start like those are things that I would recommend doing um to strengthen and grow in your walk but um yeah I think people really enjoy it uh there's also a lot of stuff we weren't able to get into but that's awesome that's really really good I'm sure yes yes happy to do it I I love talking about this stuff hope it wasn't boring for too many people but I liked it a lot yeah great so yeah I hope it's I hope it's been worthwhile and all right good night God bless everybody